New setup not sounding right

snap, crackle and pop
Lad90
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Lad90 » 14 Jun 2019 19:23

It appears turning on the pre amp would mean setting it to line which is what I have it on now. The receiver doesn’t have a phone input. It will try cleaning the switch. Would this be normal for a new turntable?

To be honest separating the speakers made a big difference but still getting some in and outs. Just out of curiosity are certain songs made this way??

Thanks for all the help so far

toaster999
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by toaster999 » 14 Jun 2019 19:33

whats the speaker model number?

Solist
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Solist » 14 Jun 2019 19:36

I think its the opposite. If you switch the knob towards phono, you engage the phono preamp. You can try, you mentioned that you plugged the turntable into the line source on the amp. When the phono preamp is on you should notice an increase in the volume and better sound quality overall. Just make sure you set the volume knob on the amp to 0 before you mess with that switch on the turntable.

Yes, you could buy the best speakers in the world, but if you neglect the physics and stack them on top of each other it wont matter ;)

If you want you can try and experiment with speaker positioning. Some speaker are designed to be used close to the back walls, some need some space to breathe. Its a matter of the manufacturer and how he thinks the speakers will be used.

For setting the speakers use a recording with vocals. Vocals tend to be positioned in between the speakers. Then move the speakers farther in or out until you get a solid vocal image in between the speakers. You can also toe them in slightly, depending on the room shape. Tweeters should ideally be at ear level.

Be careful about speaker wires, there is voltage going through when the amp is on. Just to be careful, you can listen to a song, then shut down the amp and wait a couple of seconds to discharge and then reposition the speakers and check that all the wires are still properly connected. Then and give it a listen. If the cables were to accidentally unplug and touch you or eachother, then you will have a big problem.

Lad90
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Lad90 » 14 Jun 2019 20:40

So I do have the preamp on. It’s set to line which is on. No phono on the receiver. It’s just hooked up to the av2 slot.

Would the problem be dirt even on a brand new turntable? I’ll get cleaner and give it a try anyway.

Moving the speakers actually helped tremendously but the vocals are still kind of off. Are certain songs just made that way??

Thanks for all the help so far. This forum is great 👍

Solist
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Solist » 14 Jun 2019 21:32

You are right, It confused me a bit.

It could be that the preamp on the at120lp is faulty. If the amp and speakers worked before you can narrow it down to the turntable. Try to plug something else into the amp to see if the problem is still there.

Other than that it could be an issue with the banana plugs.

Solist
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Solist » 14 Jun 2019 21:32

You are right, It confused me a bit.

It could be that the preamp on the at120lp is faulty. If the amp and speakers worked before you can narrow it down to the turntable. Try to plug something else into the amp to see if the problem is still there.

Other than that it could be an issue with the banana plugs.

zlartibartfast
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by zlartibartfast » 14 Jun 2019 22:12

Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
So I do have the preamp on. It’s set to line which is on. No phono on the receiver. It’s just hooked up to the av2 slot.
By any chance, are you using a "surround" mode on the amp such as DolbyProLogic, or similar?
Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
Would the problem be dirt even on a brand new turntable? I’ll get cleaner and give it a try anyway.
Sadly, dirt is a potential problem on gear of any age (unless you keep it in a vacuum).
Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
Moving the speakers actually helped tremendously but the vocals are still kind of off. Are certain songs just made that way??
Ummm - maybe - for special effects. Some examples are found in albums byt Alan Parsons, Pink Floyd, Beatles, etc., but it should be plain to the listener that it's supposed to sound that way. If you listen to Ella Fitzgerald and you hear it, then most likely something is wrong.
Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
Thanks for all the help so far. This forum is great 👍
So my advice is to verify you actually do have the speakers wired in-phase (red-to-red, black-to-black), then try to get them at least 8' (or 1 meter) apart, then sit about 6' away from them, right in the center. Listen closely to the bass on a record that you are familiar with ( I like "Heavy Weather" by Weather Report) and see if the balance is correct, and that the instruments stay in the same "place". Another good album to try out might be "Graceland" by Paul Simon. GReat bas lines and no "swishy" vocals.

lenjack
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by lenjack » 14 Jun 2019 22:58

If the turntable preamp is on, then leave it connected to the av2 slot. If the turntable is new, as you said, very doubtful that the switch is bad.

zlartibartfast
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by zlartibartfast » 14 Jun 2019 23:14

Lad90 - did you run the Yamaha Parametric room Acoustic Optimizer (that's a mouthful) of your receiver after moving the speakers apart from each other?

Do you have a set of headphones you can try out with this receiver?

Lad90
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Lad90 » 15 Jun 2019 01:19

toaster999 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 19:33
whats the speaker model number?
They are Andrew Jones pioneer bookshelf speakers. Ran 100 dollars

Lad90
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Lad90 » 15 Jun 2019 01:25

zlartibartfast wrote:
14 Jun 2019 22:12
Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
So I do have the preamp on. It’s set to line which is on. No phono on the receiver. It’s just hooked up to the av2 slot.
By any chance, are you using a "surround" mode on the amp such as DolbyProLogic, or similar?
Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
Would the problem be dirt even on a brand new turntable? I’ll get cleaner and give it a try anyway.
Sadly, dirt is a potential problem on gear of any age (unless you keep it in a vacuum).
Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
Moving the speakers actually helped tremendously but the vocals are still kind of off. Are certain songs just made that way??
Ummm - maybe - for special effects. Some examples are found in albums byt Alan Parsons, Pink Floyd, Beatles, etc., but it should be plain to the listener that it's supposed to sound that way. If you listen to Ella Fitzgerald and you hear it, then most likely something is wrong.
Lad90 wrote:
14 Jun 2019 20:40
Thanks for all the help so far. This forum is great 👍
So my advice is to verify you actually do have the speakers wired in-phase (red-to-red, black-to-black), then try to get them at least 8' (or 1 meter) apart, then sit about 6' away from them, right in the center. Listen closely to the bass on a record that you are familiar with ( I like "Heavy Weather" by Weather Report) and see if the balance is correct, and that the instruments stay in the same "place". Another good album to try out might be "Graceland" by Paul Simon. GReat bas lines and no "swishy" vocals.
I do have everything wired correctly 100 percent. I moved the speakers far apart. Sounds a lot better but it’s still not completely right. I did clean the switch and it nothing changed. There wasn’t much dust in there.

The setting on the amp. This is where I’m a complete noob. I’ll see if I can change it and see if it makes a difference. I’m going to try plug in headphones and see if it’s the needle as opposed to set up. Strange how the same songs on albums seem completely normal over and over. Other songs are skewed the exact same way every time

Lad90
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Lad90 » 15 Jun 2019 01:26

Solist wrote:
14 Jun 2019 21:32
You are right, It confused me a bit.

It could be that the preamp on the at120lp is faulty. If the amp and speakers worked before you can narrow it down to the turntable. Try to plug something else into the amp to see if the problem is still there.

Other than that it could be an issue with the banana plugs.
I’ll try taking the banana plugs off and doing the classic hook up see if it erases the problem thanks

Lad90
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Lad90 » 15 Jun 2019 01:33

Solist wrote:
14 Jun 2019 19:36
I think its the opposite. If you switch the knob towards phono, you engage the phono preamp. You can try, you mentioned that you plugged the turntable into the line source on the amp. When the phono preamp is on you should notice an increase in the volume and better sound quality overall. Just make sure you set the volume knob on the amp to 0 before you mess with that switch on the turntable.

Yes, you could buy the best speakers in the world, but if you neglect the physics and stack them on top of each other it wont matter ;)

If you want you can try and experiment with speaker positioning. Some speaker are designed to be used close to the back walls, some need some space to breathe. Its a matter of the manufacturer and how he thinks the speakers will be used.

For setting the speakers use a recording with vocals. Vocals tend to be positioned in between the speakers. Then move the speakers farther in or out until you get a solid vocal image in between the speakers. You can also toe them in slightly, depending on the room shape. Tweeters should ideally be at ear level.

Be careful about speaker wires, there is voltage going through when the amp is on. Just to be careful, you can listen to a song, then shut down the amp and wait a couple of seconds to discharge and then reposition the speakers and check that all the wires are still properly connected. Then and give it a listen. If the cables were to accidentally unplug and touch you or eachother, then you will have a big problem.
I tried flipping the switch. It just turned off the pre amp. Although moving the speakers apart did help a lot there’s still an issue with vocals. It’s almost like they’re background echo

zlartibartfast
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by zlartibartfast » 15 Jun 2019 01:39

That YPAO system is designed to "optimize" your EQ settings for the speakers and the room you're in. I have a similar system in my Marantz. You're supposed to run it everytime you make a change to your speaker position(s) or your room arrangement (new sofa? run it again....).

I read that your receiver has a "virtual speaker" function. Not a good thing tp have engaged when you're listening to a record, IMHO. At least, not until everything else is sorted out.

Truthfully - (not falsehoodly) I don't think you have a problem with your turntable. If it were the 'table, it wouldn't be just vocals that were muddled

Lad90
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Re: New setup not sounding right

Post by Lad90 » 16 Jun 2019 04:14

I don’t think it posted but I managed to fix it. After weeks it was a simple setting on my receiver that said standard. Can’t believe it was that. Everything sounds amazing now. Thanks for the help lads