Classical music currently playing.

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Gravitar8
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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by Gravitar8 » 31 May 2019 23:46

The 'ole boil the belt' routine. Nice call. Reading this made me think of my adventure (mis-adventure?) in the CED Selectavision world. PS Still connected to this thread, as I had a number of stereo Opera discs :) Yes the CED machines were temperamental but Man they could sound great and look very, very good contrary to the popular notion of "they suck"https://www.thesilo.ca/ced-videodiscs-m ... records-2/
DarthMaul wrote:
31 May 2019 23:07
A new belt is coming tomorrow. Boiled the old belt in water for 4 minutes yesterday to see if it would improve any. It seemed to tighten it a bit. It still slides down when the platter is on, but not with it off as far as I could observe. However, the major speed stability improvement occurred when the motor's problem went away.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 31 May 2019 23:58

Update: Got the turntable level. Checked the platter on four sides. Speed stability is fluctuating much less. The motor could be the primary reason. Earlier I dealt with the spring cups and made their positions equal.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 01 Jun 2019 15:27

Attempting to redo Side 4 of "Das Clavier Werk 4" by Edgar Krapp. This is where I recall the speed fluctuation problems first appeared. Waiting for the speed to get to its optimal level before committing to putting the stylus in the groove. No images because I'm not doing the entire double album. For the remainder, I will post images. I normally post to Facebook too, but likely I am not going to this time.

Update: The turntable is losing much less speed upon the stylus touching down! Of course, I had to wait a few minutes. It kept gradually gaining speed over a period of five minutes. Sounds like I might be back in business. I have no idea what was causing the motor's problem, but I did smell a very slight burning smell when the motor started having that issue. I think the 3-in-1 oil might have had something to do with its recovery, but I also blasted it with a degreaser prior to that. (I did not drench the motor shaft with oil. I used a sewing needle to administer it.)

If only I could get the Joel kit oil!

Edit: Drat! Sudden speed loss! The strobe was moving to the right, and I heard the music's pitch lower. Wondering if it's the belt or the motor. It stayed stable for several minutes. Stopping play for now. I will try again when the new belt arrives. If this does not help, I will get the pulley and rubber motor mount so the motor can be replaced.

It might be the belt. I will wait for the new belt before using the turntable. The stylus is not causing any noticeable drag.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by The Blue Panther » 01 Jun 2019 18:08

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DarthMaul
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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 01 Jun 2019 19:09

DarthMaul wrote:
01 Jun 2019 15:27
Attempting to redo Side 4 of "Das Clavier Werk 4" by Edgar Krapp. This is where I recall the speed fluctuation problems first appeared. Waiting for the speed to get to its optimal level before committing to putting the stylus in the groove. No images because I'm not doing the entire double album. For the remainder, I will post images. I normally post to Facebook too, but likely I am not going to this time.

Update: The turntable is losing much less speed upon the stylus touching down! Of course, I had to wait a few minutes. It kept gradually gaining speed over a period of five minutes. Sounds like I might be back in business. I have no idea what was causing the motor's problem, but I did smell a very slight burning smell when the motor started having that issue. I think the 3-in-1 oil might have had something to do with its recovery, but I also blasted it with a degreaser prior to that. (I did not drench the motor shaft with oil. I used a sewing needle to administer it.)

If only I could get the Joel kit oil!

Edit: Drat! Sudden speed loss! The strobe was moving to the right, and I heard the music's pitch lower. Wondering if it's the belt or the motor. It stayed stable for several minutes. Stopping play for now. I will try again when the new belt arrives. If this does not help, I will get the pulley and rubber motor mount so the motor can be replaced.

It might be the belt. I will wait for the new belt before using the turntable. The stylus is not causing any noticeable drag.
Now that I think about it, lubrication in the subplatter bearing has an effect on this. Too much isn't good. Also, considering that the rubber motor mount has warping, I had to pull the motor upwards. The belt was nearly coming in contact with the metal guide. Bent it slightly upwards to help prevent the belt from rubbing against it. I know I shouldn't, but it's not touching the platter so everything is fine.

Also took care of the washers on the bottom of the plinth springs recently. They came unglued when I first removed the motor from the turntable because the plinth needed to come out and they got knocked off the springs. They've been epoxied back on.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 01 Jun 2019 23:38

Gravitar8,

I am attempting to record that last Handel harpsichord record side again. Hopefully no slowdown this time. The platter got up to a higher speed faster this time. Average 33rpm speed is near the half-way point for the fine-speed adjustment knob, perhaps a little clockwise of it, meaning the platter is able to spin at a faster rate than before. The motor needed to be higher up so it doesn't touch the rubber mount (hardly at all). I ended up very slightly bending the guide post so the belt can't have a chances of rubbing against its top end.

If everything goes well, I will let the turntable rest for a bit before redoing the oldest Water Music record I have.

Edit 1: Still stable so far.

Edit 2: Just bought a 100% synthetic oil meant for Thorens turntables off eBay. Only $10.95 with free shipping. I intend to use this for the subplatter. It will have to do since I can't get the Joel kit. Unless somebody on the forums offers to sell me one. That would really help my turntable more than anything else.

Edit 3: Getting to the end of the side! Tiny speed up, but not that noticeable. This turntable has done that many times before any problems cropped up. Perhaps if I had waited, it would be even less so.

Edit 4: Successful recording. No slowdowns. Next stop, Paillard's recording of the Water Music!

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 02 Jun 2019 02:10

Redoing this album because my turntable was giving me problems last time around. If something goes wrong, I will halt the recording. Last effort didn't come to that. Hopefully it's the same here and it plays at a good speed throughout. This record is heavier than the last one.
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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 02 Jun 2019 03:41

DarthMaul wrote:
02 Jun 2019 02:10
Redoing this album because my turntable was giving me problems last time around. If something goes wrong, I will halt the recording. Last effort didn't come to that. Hopefully it's the same here and it plays at a good speed throughout. This record is heavier than the last one.

IMG_3491.jpg
Successful playback again. Resting for the night. Leaving the fine speed knob where it is. Before I play the next record, I will let the turntable get warmed up first. Another record redone. Next one is the one that got interrupted.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by banerjba » 02 Jun 2019 04:39

Darth, why are you recording? As long as the cartridge and LP are kept clean, LPs can take hundreds of plays. For anyone with a large collection which I am guessing you have, it is unlikely you will wear these out. Sorry if I missed the reason in an earlier post.

I started tonight with more of my flea market haul. Not a dud in the lot and all mint condition.

Puncinella by Stravinsky is up first on EMI Angel, led by sir Neville and the Academy. I have another Puncinella by Abbado and the LSO but the EMI recording is coupled with Suites 1 and 2 for small orchestra, which I own on cd but not lp.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 02 Jun 2019 04:44

banerjba wrote:
02 Jun 2019 04:39
Darth, why are you recording? As long as the cartridge and LP are kept clean, LPs can take hundreds of plays. For anyone with a large collection which I am guessing you have, it is unlikely you will wear these out. Sorry if I missed the reason in an earlier post.
This way I can put them onto my iPhone. I do enjoy listening to the records, but don't want to repeatedly play the records. I'd rather clean up the sound as best I can without damaging the signal so I can hear them when not at home as well, like if I'm working. However, the cleanup depending on record condition can take less or more time, along with the track splitting. I've always been this way. I keep the records as a backup in case I want to record them again with a superior stylus or turntable later on.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by banerjba » 02 Jun 2019 05:30

OK I see. My dad used to make cassette tapes of his LPs so they could be heard on portable equipment. I eventually did that on my old Nakamichi for background music but then cds came out and they are very portable as well as providing very good sound for classical.

Two months ago, my little Project table's motor started making a bit of noise. I found a good place to repair it but they also sold a new line of affordable turntables called Elipson (French). I bought one and it sounds way better than my Pro-ject does. Tonight I rotated my Dynaudio speakers for my little budget Focals and these two French components just sing.

Next up is a French Erato LP of Schumann Piano Concertos (I did not know there was more than the famous one).

This thread has me pulling out my French lps on Erato, Accord and a French DG pressing of the movie soundtrack for Le Neveu de Beethoven.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 02 Jun 2019 16:34

Let's try this again. Last time I interrupted the play of this record half way through due to speed stability problems. Last of the Erato records until the Bach albums.
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Edit: Side 1 went off without a hitch. Suffered a slowdown at the beginning of Side 2. Took the stylus off, increased the speed to compensate, but then it sped up again! Might need to degrease the subplatter's bearing and re-oil it. Might help. Don't know if the subplatter is getting gummed up on its bearing or if the belt is slipping. It's not the motor, surely, as it's able to start without issues. The synthetic Thorens oil I ordered on eBay from somebody in Owosso, MI should get to me this week.

After this album, I'm going to degrease that bearing.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 02 Jun 2019 19:42

DarthMaul wrote:
02 Jun 2019 16:34
Let's try this again. Last time I interrupted the play of this record half way through due to speed stability problems. Last of the Erato records until the Bach albums.

IMG_3506.jpg

Edit: Side 1 went off without a hitch. Suffered a slowdown at the beginning of Side 2. Took the stylus off, increased the speed to compensate, but then it sped up again! Might need to degrease the subplatter's bearing and re-oil it. Might help. Don't know if the subplatter is getting gummed up on its bearing or if the belt is slipping. It's not the motor, surely, as it's able to start without issues. The synthetic Thorens oil I ordered on eBay from somebody in Owosso, MI should get to me this week.

After this album, I'm going to degrease that bearing.
Redoing Side 2 just once. Leaving Side 1 alone. Last attempt went fairly good, but I want to see if I can do better. Last time there was a gradual speed up, and it became noticeable in the inner tracks.

Now, considering I bought the pulley and rubber mount for this turntable's motor, with a defective motor coming with the mount, I plan to get the motor replaced. It gave me the problems with it starting up again, but only briefly, as I recently tested it by trying to start it 10 times without giving the platter a push, and it started every time. But some starts were slow, so I can tell the motor isn't starting as well as it should.

I made an attempt to spray the subplatter's well with WD-40 Specialist Electronic Cleaner Spray, in an attempt to remove old oils and relube the subplatter's shaft with one drop so it has less oil and can spin more freely. I suppose that does help it. I was able to get it to spin rapidly without the belt on and it took over 100 seconds to stop.

Edit: Done with this album. Got a good recording out of both sides. Next stop? Another recording of the Music for the Royal Fireworks Music and the Water Music. This time, it's Neville Marriner and Academy of St. Martin-in-the-Fields, from 1972 on Argo. I only have four albums by Neville Marriner. One is a double album and one is a box set. The box set will be heard much later. (Schubert)

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by Gravitar8 » 02 Jun 2019 23:27

It occurred to me----- since you are recording/digitizing the recording and you have (stability) speed problems- why not just compensate via the software settings? So for eg- if you are aiming for 33 1/3 rpm playback and finding actual speed is 35 RPM when recorded, 'simply' adjust the speed without affecting pitch.

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Re: Classical music currently playing.

Post by DarthMaul » 02 Jun 2019 23:49

Gravitar8 wrote:
02 Jun 2019 23:27
It occurred to me----- since you are recording/digitizing the recording and you have (stability) speed problems- why not just compensate via the software settings? So for eg- if you are aiming for 33 1/3 rpm playback and finding actual speed is 35 RPM when recorded, 'simply' adjust the speed without affecting pitch.
That is a great idea, but the stability (speed) problems have become lesser. The speed problems were of a type that made the recording efforts not worth it due to the stylus drag being way worse than it ought to be. It was slowing down and speeding up too noticeably, indicating something was wrong. I don't mind it if the pitch change is so little that I can't perceive it. Sometimes I do make those changes in the software, by keeping an older copy of the recording around from the past to make them based on. But I also prefer to get my turntable working at its best. With the pulley and rubber mount bought online today, I intend to get the motor replaced in the end. But I also intend to get the subplatter bearing completely cleaned and lubricated right. I'm less concerned with the pitch variance now, as it was caused by a performance problem involving the motor or the subplatter. The speed has been frequently more stable lately. When I get the replacement motor installed, the performance might improve even further beyond how it did when I first got the turntable.

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