How do you separate the art from the artist?

name that tune
dysmike
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by dysmike » 12 Jan 2019 15:04

VinyldechezPierre wrote:
12 Jan 2019 14:26
dysmike wrote:
11 Jan 2019 21:56
His 'art' was horrible, no matter how you slice it. Bad, beyond bad. Like bad tourist area 'art' bad.
This sounds like someone who can't separate the two persons. Sorry.

I'm no fan of AH or his actions but I don't agree his work was that bad. Not that I would buy any of it, don't see how anyone could, really, but as an artist myself I see the main problem with his art, today, as the person. Not the art.

Yesteryear, his art didn't sell/interest any gallery because who knows what/why...

Yesteryear my own art didn't sell or interest anyone yet I didn't become a butcher of humanity.
It's unimagined, kitsch, tourist work. Postcard drawings and paintings is all they are. This is not good art. So bad he failed epically to even get into an art school. His work didn't gather interest because, even compared to his contemporaries, it wasn't good. I've looked at a lot of various work, enough to complete an MFA.. his work, just isn't good.

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 12 Jan 2019 15:38

dysmike wrote:
12 Jan 2019 15:04
VinyldechezPierre wrote:
12 Jan 2019 14:26
dysmike wrote:
11 Jan 2019 21:56
His 'art' was horrible, no matter how you slice it. Bad, beyond bad. Like bad tourist area 'art' bad.
This sounds like someone who can't separate the two persons. Sorry.

I'm no fan of AH or his actions but I don't agree his work was that bad. Not that I would buy any of it, don't see how anyone could, really, but as an artist myself I see the main problem with his art, today, as the person. Not the art.

Yesteryear, his art didn't sell/interest any gallery because who knows what/why...

Yesteryear my own art didn't sell or interest anyone yet I didn't become a butcher of humanity.
It's unimagined, kitsch, tourist work. Postcard drawings and paintings is all they are. This is not good art. So bad he failed epically to even get into an art school. His work didn't gather interest because, even compared to his contemporaries, it wasn't good. I've looked at a lot of various work, enough to complete an MFA.. his work, just isn't good.
OK

dysmike
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by dysmike » 12 Jan 2019 16:00

What can I say, I'm not a fan of realism in the 20th century. Especially when it's poorly performed technically. Bad perspective being a huge issue for me. This, at a time when we also have Matisse, Picasso, Braque, and Malevich seriously pushing boundaries.

It's sort of the same as fascist and soviet era realism. It's just boring visually, especially compared with contemporary movements.

btw, Pablo Picasso.. horrible man, really just not a good human being in terms of his personal relationships. Brilliant artist, and I love his work.

H. callahan
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by H. callahan » 12 Jan 2019 16:47

I think its not a good comparison if you find out that your wife did cheat on you.
That´s a personal relationship and you do love her, or at least did when you married her, you do trust her, or at least did etc. . An artist is rather someone who does produce a product, his art, and unless you´re a hardcore fan who would do anything for his artist, or a teenage girl willing to commit suicide because her favourite boygroup did break up, its not an appropriate comparison - and even if you´re a teenage girl it´s still a little different from being married and cheated.

Tom Cruise on the other hand is a very good comparison i think, because i think that Tom Cruise is a good actor, respectively he does movies which suit his capabilities as an actor, but i don´t like him as a person because he is Mr. Scientology.
John Travolta an the other hand is an actor i just dislike, before i knew he also is Scientology and after i found out. I can´t really tell if he is a good actor or not, i just dislike him also when he is playing the bad guy who gets killed at the end.
Regarding Tom Cruise i can appreciate when he made a good movie, but i´m not a fan of his person because he is Mr. Scientology.
Now as i havn´t been to the cinema for about 10 years now i think i did the following if i would go the cinema again:
I would not pay for a Tom Cruise movie because i don´t want to support Mr. Scientology, but i would watch the movie when it is shown on TV, because he usually does make good movies to my estimate. I really could like this guy if he just wasn´t Mr. /&%!$$§%!&( Scientology.

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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by Tinkaroo » 12 Jan 2019 17:12

I thought this thread was about music artists, but apparently it's gone in many directions! :lol:

I never cared for Matt Damon or Ben Afleck in the past but I recently thought he was pretty good in The Martian and I enjoyed Ben's performance in The Town.

On another note I got some film noir for Christmas and watched He Ran All The Way with John Garfield. On reading up I saw it was his last role since he was blacklisted and the stress helped lead to his death later that year. Apparently he wasn't the only one that the stress of blacklisting led to an early demise. Apparently Garfield had a pretty tough upbringing which showed in his character portrayals.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled programming.

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 13 Jan 2019 10:38

Tinkaroo wrote:
12 Jan 2019 17:12
We now return you to your regularly scheduled programming.
:lol:

Why talk only about music artists when the subject lends itself so well to all forms of art. One we haven't mentioned yet is writing.

There is a famous writer I had a problem with one year. I had all his books but, one year, he came out in public against something that 1/ I supported and, 2/ was weird to me considering most of his characters; he was using a certain class of people in his books but was fighting them in real life.

Result = never bought a new book of his since. Yes, you read that right. I'm still buying his books, just now new, ever. :)

poutrew
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by poutrew » 14 Jan 2019 14:50

Another good example: Thomas Kinkade, the "Painter of Light". He always represented more cold business than art in my book. He's been dead for a long time, but to this very day, most artists spit on his 'consumer' paintings... now, I personally wont buy any of his paintings to hang on my wall, because I think he uses too much white paint in his pictures to achieve his particular look, and also because I don't want to support the machine that Kinkade became both before and after his death.

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 14 Jan 2019 15:38

poutrew wrote:
14 Jan 2019 14:50
He always represented more cold business than art in my book.
Do you mean: in it for the money?

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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by poutrew » 15 Jan 2019 03:26

VinyldechezPierre wrote:
14 Jan 2019 15:38
poutrew wrote:
14 Jan 2019 14:50
He always represented more cold business than art in my book.
Do you mean: in it for the money?
Yes.

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 15 Jan 2019 15:01

poutrew wrote:
15 Jan 2019 03:26
Do you mean: in it for the money?
Yes.
[/quote]

Unfortunately, there has always been artists who where in it for the money. Probably ever since money was invented and soon thereafter made a god of sort.

Because I tend to be optimistic and an artist myself (in a field that never really made too many people rich), I think most budding artists don't really think about money when they start. :D

But when big money rolls in, and there can be quite a bit of that in music today, a person can go a bit stupid. Or crazy.

There are plenty of examples of that in history.

Tinkaroo
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by Tinkaroo » 15 Jan 2019 15:16

VinyldechezPierre wrote:
15 Jan 2019 15:01
poutrew wrote:
15 Jan 2019 03:26
Do you mean: in it for the money?
Yes.
Unfortunately, there has always been artists who where in it for the money. Probably ever since money was invented and soon thereafter made a god of sort.

Because I tend to be optimistic and an artist myself (in a field that never really made too many people rich), I think most budding artists don't really think about money when they start. :D

But when big money rolls in, and there can be quite a bit of that in music today, a person can go a bit stupid. Or crazy.

There are plenty of examples of that in history.
[/quote]

Yes as Cyndi Lauper liked to sing money changes everything.

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 15 Jan 2019 15:30

:lol:

Ain't that the truth.

vanakaru
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by vanakaru » 15 Jan 2019 15:43

Yes when artist sells his image(personality, life story, preferences etc) and you buy this, you have expectations and seller has obligations. Then if it comes out that in reality it all is a lie you should be able to get some kind of satisfaction(refund) - revenge should do well then.

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 16 Jan 2019 11:51

vanakaru wrote:
15 Jan 2019 15:43
revenge should do well then.
Revenge? A bit harsh I would say since, I think, most of these people are victims of the system that the fans have created.

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Re: How do you separate the art from the artist?

Post by vanakaru » 16 Jan 2019 12:53

Or the fans are victims of the system that have created the artist image. It may be that the same system that created the image is actually protecting its creation by conducting the public hanging of a artist that is damaging the product by not living up to the image.