Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

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lini
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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by lini » 22 Aug 2012 02:51

Alec124c41 wrote:A sumiko/Jelco HS-12 headshell has adjustable azimuth. (...)
True, Alec, but that's an SME/Technics style headshell for S/J-shaped arms with matching connector. The DP300F has got a straight arm, though - and hence needs an angled headshell...

Overlock: I'm with Raphael there and would also suggest to have it exchanged by the dealer. Not only because a new table shouldn't require being fixed by the user first - but also because tonearm bearings often are rather sensitive...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by Simonatsea » 23 Aug 2012 01:25

I too have a similar "problem" with my tt. I took it to commercial electronics in Vancouver to get my 2m blue cartridge professionally mounted and aligned, they sell this table as well and they did not mention anything to me with regards to headshell azimuth. If it was a defect I presume they would have mentioned something to me. I will ask however next time I'm in. So far pleased with the table however when placing the needle on the record it normally skip's in a line or two. I imagine its gotta be hard on both the stylus and record. Any recommendations to cure that? Anyone have similar issue? Maybe due to the azimuth of the headshell as the stylus might load up like a "spring" when it lands on the record propelling itself inwards?.....
Anyone have any comments on the built in preamp versus a standalone phono stage? Looking at the graham slee gram amp 2 se? Comments?

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by overlock » 23 Aug 2012 19:25

I spoke to Denon about the problem -- they told me the 2 screws under the arm indeed do adjust the azimuth. Problem is you can't get to them w/o removing the arm, which I don't want to get into.... returned item to Crutchfield today.

Thanks for the advice
Bob

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by SKH » 30 Sep 2012 16:14

I too have a DP-300F with the azimuth off; this table is my replacement for an old JVC QL-7. I bought a little screw driver set at Sears - just the right length and loosened the (2) screw under the arm and adjusted it for my newly purchased Denon DL-110 cartridge. The DL-100 is a perfect mate for this table. I mounted my DL-301MKII, but is was not a good match (also azimuth adjusted).

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by audionuts373 » 13 Nov 2012 23:05

SKH wrote:I too have a DP-300F with the azimuth off; this table is my replacement for an old JVC QL-7. I bought a little screw driver set at Sears - just the right length and loosened the (2) screw under the arm and adjusted it for my newly purchased Denon DL-110 cartridge. The DL-100 is a perfect mate for this table. I mounted my DL-301MKII, but is was not a good match (also azimuth adjusted).
Can you tell me the Sears stock number for the screwdriver or post a picture?

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by Playercoach » 17 Nov 2012 07:23

Yo, just picked u[ a near new DP300-F for 50 bucks...my head shell is also a bit off but it still sounds great. Did anybody adjust the head shell properly? was it easy?

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by jdryyz » 12 Jan 2014 17:09

Add me to the list of those with a newly purchased 300F and skewed azimuth, although not as bad as the first post. I did something I would not recommend to anyone, though-- I loosened the headshell screw and rotated it to the right. The headshell still looks a little off, but the vertical line on the cartridge now looks perpendicular to the platter. I too would like to know the Sears stock number for the mini driver set though. :)

Also, can anyone recommend a good FREE protractor tool for this player?

Thanks!

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by jdryyz » 13 Jan 2014 01:44

Can the protractor on this site be used with a straight tone arm?

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/freestuff.htm

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by lini » 13 Jan 2014 05:08

For the protractors the general arm tube shape doesn't really matter - however, the arm geometry in particular may very well fit better or worse to certain protractors for certain major alignment variants and minor variations of these.

To get a better overview on that topic and a better idea of what you're doing, I'd suggest you to go to the "Tools" section of VE, click on "Cartridge Alignment Protractors" and first read Seb's guide. Next thing I'd do is to find out what the original alignment geometry chosen by the manufacturer might be (using JaS' alignment calculator pro with the tonearm specs provided by the manufacturer, possibly supplemented by own measurements...) - 'cause with the original geometry the cart usually will be nicely in line with the headshell, which is nicer for visual appearance, but just of secondary interest, if the original alignment geometry isn't to my liking... And the calculator results will also be helpful to check, whether a different alignment geometry would be possible on a certain arm with a certain headshell and a certain cartridge (or with a certain integrated cart model and without the headshell...). And then I'd decide, which alignment tool to use - i.e. either which protractor exatcly or which more or less convenient alignment jig or some abbreviation method like 52- or 49-mm-horizontal-distance-from-headshell-washer-to-needle-tip-trick for certain Technics and Pioneer models.

Hence, as the providers of that protractor you've linked to apparently didn't bother to name the particular geometry and inner/outer radius of the recorded area, one would first have to download it, check the null points and then use the alignment calculator to determine those (geometry & radii) by back-calculation. So I'd rather suggest you to use one of the protractors provided here on VE, 'cause these are better documented - thus, even if you don't bother to determine the original alignment geometry first and rather find out what fits by trying right away, you'll at least know, which approach(es) exactly you'll have tried.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by jdryyz » 13 Jan 2014 18:11

Thanks you for the info. I will check out Seb's guide.

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by kwyjibo » 15 Jan 2014 19:48

I had the same azimuth problem with mine, even with the extra headshell I got from Sears. I tried many times to disassemble the arm and loosen those bottom screws hoping I could fix the angle of the receiver to no avail-- those screws go into the threaded holes of an internal part with very little play, so there's no way to adjust.

Finally about 6 months later I figured out a 10 seconds fix: take out the headshell, grip the plug end of it (silver part) with some Vice Grips/Locking Pliers, then hold on to the body of the headshell tightly and gently twist. Worked like a charm for both of them with no ill side-effects (save for a tiny scrape on the plug that no one will ever see)

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by jdryyz » 19 Jan 2014 00:31

I think I achieved similar results with the method I used without having to mar the connection. So far, so good. Out of curiosity, do you see any change in the position of the headshell as it arcs across the platter? I am seeing a little movement in the opposite direction when the arm is closer to the inner tracks. Looks like a subtle "pendulum" effect with the tone arm, or perhaps just an optical illusion due to the change in viewing angle. I know I wasn't imagining the original azimuth problem, that's for sure.

Regarding what protractor to use, I opted for the "stupid" one, specifically Loefgren. The lines are matching up for nicely across both points. As the timing would have it, I also just acquired a new Ortofon 2M RED. A quick bit of advice I was given for use with the 300F was to simply line up front the cartridge with the top of the headshell until they are flush. Seems to work well! Although, I believe the point of the protractor is to have the stylus tip land exactly on the point where the darkest intersecting lines meet. Is this correct? If so, my stylus would need to move back slightly (approx 1/8") to make it. The new cartridge sounds great the way it is, however! Big improvement over the stock cart.

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by majick47 » 12 Feb 2014 21:22

Correcting the problem will probably require removing the tonearm and with the proper size high quality screw driver loosen the screws and attempt to adjust the azimuth. Also possible the headshell is defective. With an entry level turntable that sells for $200 buyers should realize that QC may be compromised to meet the price point. If under warranty return for refund or replacement, that's what new is for.

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by vonchowder » 25 Mar 2015 21:58

SKH wrote:I too have a DP-300F with the azimuth off; this table is my replacement for an old JVC QL-7. I bought a little screw driver set at Sears - just the right length and loosened the (2) screw under the arm and adjusted it for my newly purchased Denon DL-110 cartridge. The DL-100 is a perfect mate for this table. I mounted my DL-301MKII, but is was not a good match (also azimuth adjusted).
Old thread, I know... but was scanning through and saw the above comment about the DL-301MLII. I just mounted one of these on my 300f and it sounds amazing. Not sure if SKH was using the 301 or the DL-100 with MM or MC pre. I'm running it through a suitable MC preamp with plenty of gain; Just thought I would update this hear in case someone wanting to know about MC cart options for this table. Thanks for the thread.

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Re: Azimuth problems on new Denon DP-300F

Post by ultradianguy » 20 Sep 2019 20:08

Resurrecting an old thread....I'm having the exact same issue with my tonearm on this tt. Azimuth is about 3.5 deg off. I tried twisting the tonearm using a piece of rubber and a wrench, but couldn't get any movement (I did manage to scratch the tonearm, despite the rubber though....).
I can see the setscrew that would allow the tonearm to rotate. Don't understand why they put at the bottom so that you have to remove the tonearm to get at it. (I can also see the two screws at the front - I might manage to get in there if I can find a screwdriver that will fit...but from what people say, there's not much movement there anyway).

I can shim my cartridges - but I have 4, so that's kind of a pain, and will make future alignments that much trickier. So my question is - is it risky to remove the tonearm? I figured I would remove it at the pivot - that is, remove the two horizontal screws that hold it in the pivot, loosen set screw, rotate arm, put back in pivot. Is re-centering the tonearm in that pivot mechanism difficult ? That seems like the right way to do it - but I wondered how precise centering needs to be, or if there's any other tricky reassembly that isn't obvious.

Service manual isn't any help for this, surprisingly. (Unless I missed it - will have another look)

Thanks!