Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

3 minute wonder
Coffee Phil
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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by Coffee Phil » 28 Aug 2019 18:04

Hi BMRR,

Here is something on record EQ: https://midimagic.sgc-hosting.com/mixphono.htm

From the above I think the bass turn is 300 Hz as opposed to 500 Hz in RIAA. I think I would have to hear the playback EQ switched AB while the record is playing to notice the difference. Likewise I think I would also need the AB test with the record playing to notice the difference between the ~13 db @ 10 KHz of RIAA and the 16 dB listed for the Columbia.

Your 78 U-tube videos are really good! I have to believe you aren't just pointing an i-phone at the record player. Can you give a little tutorial on how to do what you did?

Phil
BMRR wrote:
28 Aug 2019 13:40
Bob Dillon wrote:
27 Aug 2019 23:40
The sound on the Day/James records is very good. It's likely to have been recorded on an Ampex model 200 tape machine - and for the time period - probably at 30 i.p.s.

A properly mastered CD of this from the original tape could also sound great.
I've heard the CD version and it does sound great. The most noticeable difference is the lack of pops/clicks and surface noise, of course. If you set that aside, the overall sound quality isn't all that difference than the 78, which is a testament to how good 78s sounded toward the end of 78 production.

I'm not sure what curve Columbia used for 78s in 1950 but I think it must have been pretty close to RIAA because it sounds great through my RIAA preamp without any additional equalization.

Bob Dillon
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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by Bob Dillon » 28 Aug 2019 18:26

I've got one source that claims 300 Hz bass turnover and treble rolloff same as NAB for this era of Columbia 78. Maybe they were using NAB on these early tape masters there at Columbia ?

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by BMRR » 29 Aug 2019 14:28

Coffee Phil wrote:
28 Aug 2019 18:04

Your 78 U-tube videos are really good! I have to believe you aren't just pointing an i-phone at the record player. Can you give a little tutorial on how to do what you did?
Thanks Phil!

I record my vinyl/shellac videos using the built-in webcam of my [very old] laptop. I connect the line output of my phono preamp to the line input of the laptop. I use QuickTime to capture the webcam video and the line audio simultaneously. Then I upload the resulting file to YouTube. I don't do any editing or post processing. The audio you hear is exactly what comes out of the phono preamp.

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by BMRR » 29 Aug 2019 14:32

The cartridge/stylus I'm using for these recordings is a Shure M44 cartridge with a JICO N44-3 stylus. Previously I had been using a Pfanstiehl N44-3, and to be honest I can't hear any difference between them. They both work very well. I ran the Pfanstiehl at 4-5g; I run the JICO at 3.5g.

Coffee Phil
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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by Coffee Phil » 29 Aug 2019 18:44

Hi BMRR,

Thanks! I also have an ancient Windows machine. It has a user facing webcam. I don't know if it works, but I'll try to check it out. Then I can load Quick Time, if I don't have it.

I'm sure my iPad will do the video fairly well, but I would insist on the audio directly from my preamp and I don't think that is possible with it. The charging port is USB and I do have a USB codec in my system. I'll have to ask the Apple folks if that is do-able.

My main 78 cartridge is also a Shure M44. I started with a Shure N44-3 but it met with a sad incident so I have an Astatic packaged supposedly genuine Shure replacement. It seem fine but I'm very tempted by the elliptical N44-3e from Esoteric Sound. I also have 3 mill retipped stylus assembly for my Sonus Blue and a GE RPX triple play.

Phil
BMRR wrote:
29 Aug 2019 14:28
Coffee Phil wrote:
28 Aug 2019 18:04

Your 78 U-tube videos are really good! I have to believe you aren't just pointing an i-phone at the record player. Can you give a little tutorial on how to do what you did?
Thanks Phil!

I record my vinyl/shellac videos using the built-in webcam of my [very old] laptop. I connect the line output of my phono preamp to the line input of the laptop. I use QuickTime to capture the webcam video and the line audio simultaneously. Then I upload the resulting file to YouTube. I don't do any editing or post processing. The audio you hear is exactly what comes out of the phono preamp.

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by josephazannieri » 01 Sep 2019 14:56

Yo 78 Spinners and Hi, Phil:

I am playing Musicraft 78 Album 52, Artie Shaw Plays Cole Porter. I inherited it when I was given about 2000 records including this album. The previous owner, a dance teacher who had been in business in Norwalk from 1948 to 1974, decided to give up her record collection and gave it to me because her children did not play records.

The album actually belonged to her deceased husband, who was a drummer and had an excellent tase in jazz music. It includes the following:

Record # 389: Night And Day/Get Out Of Town, vocal by Mel Torme; Record#391: Love For Sale/You Do Something To Me, vocal by Teddy Walters; Record # 392: I've Got You Under My Skin/My Heart Belongs To Daddy, Vocal by Kitty Kallen; and, last but definitely not least, Record # 390: In The Still Of The Night/What Is This Thing Called Love, vocals by Mel Torme and the Mel-Tones. My records have been played to death and are grossly worn. Here is a sample from Record # 390, which I have borrowed from YouTube, where the record is much better than my copy.

https://youtu.be/HkXzRW02PpE

You will note the dense '40s harmonies, Mel Torme's short short short solo (4 bars) and the coolness of the whole thing. 8) 8) 8) 8)

And good luck to all the other high speed spinners from that old pursuer of the cool,

Joe Z.

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by BMRR » 01 Sep 2019 17:18

That was fantastic!

Coffee Phil
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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by Coffee Phil » 02 Sep 2019 02:18

Hi Joe,

As an old guy I get saddened when someone has to give up a collection like that, but I’m happy that you were able to give them a loving home!

Really good stuff.

Phil
josephazannieri wrote:
01 Sep 2019 14:56
Yo 78 Spinners and Hi, Phil:

I am playing Musicraft 78 Album 52, Artie Shaw Plays Cole Porter. I inherited it when I was given about 2000 records including this album. The previous owner, a dance teacher who had been in business in Norwalk from 1948 to 1974, decided to give up her record collection and gave it to me because her children did not play records.

The album actually belonged to her deceased husband, who was a drummer and had an excellent tase in jazz music. It includes the following:

Record # 389: Night And Day/Get Out Of Town, vocal by Mel Torme; Record#391: Love For Sale/You Do Something To Me, vocal by Teddy Walters; Record # 392: I've Got You Under My Skin/My Heart Belongs To Daddy, Vocal by Kitty Kallen; and, last but definitely not least, Record # 390: In The Still Of The Night/What Is This Thing Called Love, vocals by Mel Torme and the Mel-Tones. My records have been played to death and are grossly worn. Here is a sample from Record # 390, which I have borrowed from YouTube, where the record is much better than my copy.

https://youtu.be/HkXzRW02PpE

You will note the dense '40s harmonies, Mel Torme's short short short solo (4 bars) and the coolness of the whole thing. 8) 8) 8) 8)

And good luck to all the other high speed spinners from that old pursuer of the cool,

Joe Z.

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by josephazannieri » 02 Sep 2019 03:15

Yo BMRR and Phil:

The interesting aspect of that record is that it presents Mel Torme as a member of a well integrated vocal group 8) 8) 8) 8), rather that as a soloist =D> =D> =D> =D>, which is the way that most people know him.

Thanks for taking the time to listen, and good luck and good wishes from the former owners of these records, and the old guy who is really dizzy from watching those fast-spinning labels,

Joe Z.

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by Bob Dillon » 02 Sep 2019 04:03

josephazannieri wrote:
02 Sep 2019 03:15
Yo BMRR and Phil:

The interesting aspect of that record is that it presents Mel Torme as a member of a well integrated vocal gro
Here is Mel with his longtime drummer Donny Osbourne. A clip that shows what a great musician Mel was. Chops ? You want 'em, Mel's got 'em. https://youtu.be/pHarJwk0OQA

Coffee Phil
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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by Coffee Phil » 03 Sep 2019 17:22

Hi Joe and Bob,

When I think of Mel Torme I first think of the Mel-Tones and the stuff they did with Artie Shaw, but I'm a bit long in the tooth.

Bob, as a big Ella fan that video was incredable! His scat ability would likely even scare Ella!

Phil

Coffee Phil
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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by Coffee Phil » 03 Sep 2019 17:22

Hi Joe and Bob,

When I think of Mel Torme I first think of the Mel-Tones and the stuff they did with Artie Shaw, but I'm a bit long in the tooth.

Bob, as a big Ella fan that video was incredible! His scat ability would likely even scare Ella!

Phil

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by BMRR » 03 Sep 2019 17:34

Speaking of Ella and Mel...


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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by vinyl master » 04 Sep 2019 04:30

Spot on, BMRR! Spot on! =D>

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Re: Currently Playing — at 78 RPM

Post by josephazannieri » 29 Sep 2019 04:46

Yo fast spinners:

Tonight I pull out my father's old copy of Manuel de Falla's dark, atmospheric Andalusian Gypsy ballet, El Amor Brujo (Sometimes translated as "The Sorcerer's Bride,") recorded in 1946. Leopold Stokowski conducts the Hollywood Bowl Orchestra, and the vocal soloist is my favorite mezzo-soprano of all time, the great Nan Merriman. The record is pretty badly worn, but with my usual quick'n'dirty tone control equalization (Back off the bass enough to get rid of the tubby sound from RIAA bass boost, and turn up the treble enough to get back the vocal sibilants and the "bite" in the brass), it sounds pretty good. This is the ballet that contains the famous concert excerpt, the "Ritual Fire Dance." Victor Masterworks 1089, containing RCA 11-9396, RCA 11-9397, and RCA 11-1998.

The three 12 inch records take about 17 minutes to play, and require 6 record changes on my single play turntable. Merriman had performed the piece at a late summer outdoor concert at the Hollywood Bowl. She wore a white lace evening dress, which gave a contrast to her August poolside tan, giving her a dark, gypsy-like appearance. She went into the RCA studios in Los Angeles two days later, producing this stunning recording. The Los Angeles reviewers and Stokowski raved about her performance here, describing it as "vocal perfection," with an authentic Spanish sound, backed up by solid vocal technique. Vocal excerpts from this recording are found here: https://youtu.be/Av4qV-C8QZ8 YouTube sound is way rolled off, but still worth listening to.

When the 26 year old Merriman was invited by Stokowski to perform it, she went to her record collection and took out an earlier abridged version sung by the famous flamenco dancer. "La Argentinita," on Decca (Decca A290), and decided that she wanted to do it. Turned out to be a wise decision, since it proved that she could deliver an excellent performance, and sell records. It got her a contract with RCA, which continued until Arturo Toscanini's retirement in 1954. At that point she moved to Europe and EMI, taking up residence in Amsterdam until her retirement at age 45 in 1965.

And good luck from that dizzy old label watcher, who says, "Come on, guys and girls, spin that shellac,"

Joe Z.

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