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78 to 33

Postby aveey_marie » 18 Nov 2015 18:27

Im looking to buy an antique turntable that plays 78s. I was wondering if its possible to change the speed to play newer records at 33. Any help would be much appreciated!
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby Coffee Phil » 18 Nov 2015 21:45

Hi Avey_marie,

Have you picked out the machine yet? 78s machines range from machines which play-back records acoustically with a needle and fairly heavy soundbox on the tone arm to modern machines which can play back the records in a more gentle manner with an electrical pickup. Traditionally 78 RPM records were pressed into a fairly hard shellac material which could tolerate the heavy pickups. Around the late 20s and early 30s 33 1/3 RPM records started to appear which were made of similar material and had similar wide grooves. Slowing the spring motor on an early machine by modifing the governor to play these early transcription and movie sound discs would probably be fine however you should never put a vinyl Lp on such a machine. Also by the 1940s vinyl 78s started to appear. Those records also should be kept away from the old acoustic machines.

If your interest is in modern Lps as well as old 78s there are modern players which will play 78s as well as Lps. Be sure the player has a pickup cartridge which will accept microgroove styli (needles) as well as standard groove styli for the 78s.

If you want an old acoustic machine (I would love to have one) by all means buy one but keep your Lps as well as vinyl 78s away from it.

Tell us what you are wanting to do and there are many here who can advise you.

Phil

aveey_marie wrote:Im looking to buy an antique turntable that plays 78s. I was wondering if its possible to change the speed to play newer records at 33. Any help would be much appreciated!
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby vinyl master » 23 Nov 2015 04:59

You could always go for a classic Dual or a Garrard...My 1009's are great, since they play all 4 speeds, including 16-inch transcription discs...Where are you located? Maybe there is something locally that would do the trick... :-k
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby circularvibes » 23 Nov 2015 06:03

Hey VM, Methinks you mean 16 2/3 RPM discs, not 16 inch transcriptions. There are no Dual turntables and very few Garrards that will accommodate a 16 inch disc. Otherwise, I think the OP wants to buy a vintage machine and hopes it can be retrofitted for modern use, which of course is not a good idea for many technical reasons. I would like the OP to post a picture of what they wish to buy so we may provide better info.
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby vinyl master » 23 Nov 2015 07:48

My bad...16 2/3 discs...And my basement buddy has a ton of them! #-o I must be getting lazy at typing this stuff... :oops: The Duals will accommodate all four speeds...I don't know about the Garrards, but the OP talked about 33's (actually 33 1/3 LP's) and 78's anyway...It would be nice to know what he's really looking for, so we could advise further... :-k
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby circularvibes » 23 Nov 2015 07:54

I would like to know more about what 16 rpm discs your buddy has. Not to go off topic but I am looking for some talking books in good shape.
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby vinyl master » 23 Nov 2015 10:39

I believe he has a lot of classical and opera stuff, with a few show tunes thrown in...I'll have to raid his basement again one of these days, and see what else I can find...I've documented much of it already on past threads, esp. the LP's and 45's, but he still has quite a stash...
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby jives11 » 23 Nov 2015 11:14

You should also consider the Goldring/Lenco GL75 or 78. These decks have continuous speed adjustment from around 12 to 80 RPM. The popular speeds i.e 33/45/78 are merely preset preferences on this continuum, which can be useful as I believe there is a fair amount of pitch variation with 78's
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby Mark E Smith's Dentist » 23 Nov 2015 12:38

I may be wrong but my reading of this topic is that the poster wishes to convert a gramophone to play vinyl.

We need clarification.


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Re: 78 to 33

Postby jives11 » 23 Nov 2015 20:07

Mark E Smith's Dentist wrote:I may be wrong but my reading of this topic is that the poster wishes to convert a gramophone to play vinyl.

We need clarification.


JT


Well spotted . Is that wise though ? playing 33 LP's using a 78 Gramophone needle is not going to be kind to those LP's, in fact it will destroy them
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby Mark E Smith's Dentist » 23 Nov 2015 20:23

It just wouldn't work. Even if you could create some kind of arm that didn't exert a vast amount of VTF on a record the sound out of a horn would be horrible because of the equalisation applied to records when they're mastered.

I know someone who has a vintage personal turntable made by Pioneer for the Japanese market that has an acoustic pick-up (with a diaphragm like a gramophone) and the sound travels down pipes to earpieces - like you used to get on planes in the '70s. It's still sealed in the box so I don't know how it could possibly work but the fact that the idea didn't take off suggests to me that it was a bad idea.


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Re: 78 to 33

Postby diego1248 » 02 Feb 2017 22:58

At the direct drive model DUAL 701 you can change the speed to 78 with only a variable resistor and a switch. Another way (I often used) playing the 78 records with 33 or 45 (better)and let correct the speed with software. I used "WAVEPURITY" for that purpose with the Anti-RIAA-plugin (for getting the original sound when using a regular phono-pre-amp with normal RIAA-characteristic). For playing 78 records you must use a special 78 "needle" (broader than for 45+33 records) or an old ("nearly out of good working") 33/45 needle.
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby ndiamone » 13 Aug 2017 03:55

vinyl master wrote:I believe he has a lot of classical and opera stuff, with a few show tunes thrown in...I'll have to raid his basement again one of these days, and see what else I can find...I've documented much of it already on past threads, esp. the LP's and 45's, but he still has quite a stash...
If you ever got through documenting the 16 RPMs I think we'd all be curious as to what's there - esp me and the handful of other guys who just embarked on a H U G E transfer project involving dozens of types of 16 RPM discs (7 inch 10 inch 12 inch 9 inch Seeburg etc etc)
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby J. S. Bach » 19 Aug 2017 06:04

Hmmm, I thought that 16s were mainly talking books.
Later gator,
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Re: 78 to 33

Postby Coffee Phil » 19 Aug 2017 06:47

Most of the records intended for home machines were, but there were the Seeburg background music machines and Chrysler's Hi Way Hi Fi machines which were 16 2/3 RPM and used a 0.5 mil stylus.

Phil

J. S. Bach wrote:Hmmm, I thought that 16s were mainly talking books.
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