Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

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Alec124c41
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Alec124c41 » 05 Jan 2018 06:11

The stylus should rest on the protractor.
I don't understand the second question.
How is it sounding, now?

Cheers,
Alec

Sunwire
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Sunwire » 05 Jan 2018 06:48

The db systems protractor has two parts. The top part is clear.
The instructions can be found on the db systems web site here (see DBP-10):
http://www.dbsystemsaudio.com/access.html

Alec124c41
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Alec124c41 » 05 Jan 2018 16:04

That is a clever design that allows for your choice of offset angle.
However, I am not seeing the usefulness of this feature. All you really need is to have the lines at right angles to each other, and markings for the chosen null points.
Perhaps it is meant as a measurement tool.

Cheers,
Alec

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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Sunwire » 05 Jan 2018 23:38

I own one of these, but don't have the transparent part.
It was lying around one of the shops where I worked back in the early 80s and was headed for the trash because the transparent part was missing.
After reading the instructions, I think the major advantage of the design is that using the transparent part gives you pretty specific guidance about how far back or forward you need to move the cartridge to get the overhang correct.
Beyond that, I don't see any advantage, but I may be missing something.
I use Conrad Hoffman's arc protractor generator tool.

i_like_macs
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by i_like_macs » 13 Jan 2018 03:37

Alec124c41 wrote:The stylus should rest on the protractor.
I don't understand the second question.
How is it sounding, now?

Cheers,
Alec
I'm sorry for not replying sooner. I didn't see that new replies were posted on a newly created second page. I was repeatedly refreshing the first page wondering whether there were any new replies.

And thank you very much for answering my first question.

As for how my turntable is sounding, I have nothing to compare it to, but with the new cork mat (and much generous Help from Alec), the cartridge is at least not scraping on the record surface. I'm not primarily a vinyl listener, but resurrected the Systemdek IIX to digitize some records for my mom. What I'm noticing, especially on older records, are many clicks and pops, even after cleaning the records with a discwasher D4+ Record Care System brush and a Hunt EDA Carbon Fiber Record Cleaning Brush. Nevertheless, when digitizing records, I was surprised that the bass extended much deeper than I expected, although transients were not as well defined as in digital recordings. Also, the dynamic range of some records were much wider (i.e., around 60 dB) than expected. Another thing I noticed was rumbling noise, but perhaps this is part and parcel of the vinyl experience.

I know that there are nice record cleaners that use suction to remove dust from records, but unfortunately I don't have the money (or inclination) to purchase one...

Alec124c41
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Alec124c41 » 13 Jan 2018 05:39

With the Discwasher brush, use a small spray bottle, such as those that are used for cleaning glasses, to dampen the brush, then rotate the leading edge upward, as the record turns, to lift off the dust. I use 1 part isopropyl alcohol to 4 parts distilled water.
Lay the carbon fiber across the grooves of the rotating record, and slowly slide it off the edge, This avoids the line left by just lifting it.
Have you oiled the platter and motor bearings?

Cheers,
Alec

i_like_macs
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by i_like_macs » 13 Jan 2018 06:21

Oh, I see! I must try your spray bottle/rotate brush upward method additionally to sliding my Hunt brush off the record. I have been seeing a line of dust on the record otherwise! So I assume it's OK to have the turntable motor spin the record as I apply brushes. I was a little concerned that the turntable slows down considerably if I apply the Discwasher brush flat (i.e., parallel) to the record surface.

I have never applied oil to any part of the turntable. Is this important, and if so how is this accomplished?

I apologize that I only have questions, but am grateful for those of you like yourself who have answers.

Alec124c41
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Alec124c41 » 14 Jan 2018 06:20

We all have questions. That's how we get answers.
The platter bearing and the motor bearing are the moving parts.
Lift off the platter, and take out the sub-platter. If the oil is gunky, it should be cleaned out of the well, and off the shaft. I gather that a heavier oil is better for these, #30 machine oil or #90 gear oil. About 0.8 cc is recommended, if you have the pump bearing (Grooves in the shaft). For turntables with balls and plain shafts, I cover the ball in the well, and put a drop on the shaft.
Check the ball bearing at the bottom for wear.
For the motor, a drop of sewing machine oil on a small screwdriver, touched to the motor shaft under the pulley, will run down into the top motor bearing.
Some turntables slow down a lot, when you are cleaning a record. If necessary, you can Help it with a finger on the label.

Cheers,
Alec

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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by i_like_macs » 16 Jan 2018 21:19

Thank you very much again for entertaining all of my questions Alec.

I haven't checked what the oil looks like, but was first wondering where I can buy machine oil or gear oil. Could you please tell me whether these bottles of gear oil I saw at Home Depot are OK for use on a turntable shaft? It's rated SAE 75W-90, but I'm unsure whether the "90" is the same thing as the one in "#90 gear oil."
IMG_2907.jpg
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As for sewing machine oil, I'm guessing there's only one type, such as the Singer one below.

https://www.amazon.com/Singer-Machine-O ... achine+oil

Alec124c41
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Alec124c41 » 17 Jan 2018 17:30

That is more oil than you will ever need for your turntable.
Look at the motor oil section, and you can get #30 oil for less than half of that. Plus, you can put it in your car, in the summer.
If your shaft is the plain style, you could probably use 3-in-One Electric motor oil, which is #20 machine oil. This is not their all-purpose formulation.
Some oils, like regular 3-in-One, will gum up in a few years, and this you want to avoid.

Cheers,
Alec

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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by i_like_macs » 18 Jan 2018 04:30

Oh I see! Thank you very much as always. I'll look for the 3-In-One electric motor oil then. I'll make sure not to buy the regular 3-In-One oil.

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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by i_like_macs » 31 Jan 2018 00:12

Hello,

I haven't yet made the one-part-isopropyl-alcohol-to-four-parts-distilled-water record cleaner, but I have procured the liquids so far.
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I've also just bought the recommended oils (i.e., sewing machine oil and SAE 20 electric motor oil).
DSC_0001.jpg
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I haven't applied the lubricants yet to the turntable parts, but I'm sure they can only make things better! Thank you very much Alec for your generous Help. My turntable was resurrected with minimal expenditure!

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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by i_like_macs » 31 Jan 2018 02:32

I've now applied the 3-In-One oil to the spindle and the sewing machine oil to the motor spindle. I've also made the alcohol-based cleaning fluid, which I applied using the Discwasher brush. Wow, the spindle turns so freely now! :-)

However, I may have wet my records too much with cleaning solution, as I heard distortion modulated with audio signal level, although this could have been due to the 9 V batteries in my Hagerman Bugle phono preamp, which are Energizer rechargeables that are over ten years old. One of them measures only around 6 V fully charged. :( I think I'll get some newer rechargeable batteries that hold their charge longer. Otherwise, perhaps I need to let wet records dry out before playing. Even after applying the dry side of the Discwasher brush, I couldn't get records to fully dry out. Maybe I'm applying too much fluid in my quest to achieve pop-and-crackle-free records. I have a record of Vladimir Horowitz my piano teacher gave me, which has many pops and crackles, even after cleaning using Alec's method.

Alec124c41
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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by Alec124c41 » 31 Jan 2018 03:48

Get a small spray bottle, like you get to clean your glasses, and fill it with your solution.
Spritz your Diskwasher brush, so that it is slightly damp all over. (Don't be obsessive about this - just give it a spray.)
Put this across the grooves of the turning record, leading side of handle low, and slowly rotate the leading edge upward, as you go around the record. This will remove the dust, negate any static, and not leave a wet record.

Cheers,
Alec

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Re: Cartridge scraping on record, please Help

Post by i_like_macs » 31 Jan 2018 05:27

Thank you for your reply Alec! I will try your suggestion for cleaning records.