Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

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MacTeagle
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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by MacTeagle » 22 Jun 2018 23:18

I've had one record affected such as this, with a very clear rectangular pattern. For me the culprit was easy to identify. My Pink Floyd "The Wall" double album has a rectangular fogging on the A side of the first disc, the face that would be closest to the front of the gatefold. As you probably know that gatefold came with a vinyl cling "sticker" on the gloss surface of the album. It wasn't really a sticker since it didn't stay attached with adhesive. It was a similar material to a car windscreen badge. So, the original "Pink Floyd "The Wall"" Logo wrecked the LP as it sat in storage for a few years in the attic. The fogging is the exact shape of the sticker and in the exact location I had that sticker on the album cover. Watch out for this one, and watch out for whatever other albums you leave resting against "The Wall" in storage.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Max75 » 14 Jan 2019 17:37

I came across this thread by chance, and after reading about this fact of the PVC outer sleeves that can ruin vinyl also if they're inside their inner sleeves on their albums I was worried for my records, so I'm immediately removing all the PVC outer sleeves from my LPs and 45s and I think I'll replace them with polyethylene outer sleeves; what brand do you recommend me to better protect my fav sound source?

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by joyceju » 04 Feb 2019 17:59

Hi, I thought I would bring this up again, as I have read on so many forums that PVC outer sleeves are bad for the artwork on the album covers - is this correct? I see alot of companies are selling the PVC outer covers still. One of them insisted there is no such issue using them (they do not get stuck to the cardboard album covers over time or cause any damage to the artwork according to them). I would like to use them, as they keep their stiffness and stay on the album cover when putting them back and taking them out of the shelving and also they are available in gatefold format, which the other types are not, but I am now wary. I am about to invest in quite a lot of outer sleeves, so any thoughts about this (remember - I am talking about outer covers for the album covers only, NOT using PVC for the inner sleeves, so no contact with the vinyl at all). Thanks for any answers on this.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by joyceju » 04 Feb 2019 18:10

.. Or is the problem that somehow whatever the pvc gives off over time can go through the album cover and affect the vinyl?

Sinsonido
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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Sinsonido » 10 Feb 2019 23:56

Looks like I'm probably going to have to do a major overhaul. I thought those lined sleeves were protective and now I see I may have a lot of unintended damage.

I just looked at my Island pressing of King Crimson Red and it was in one of those rather tight beach ball covers, and the inner has staining on at the edges as if the liner is beginning to leach through. Had to look at it with a very bright light but the tiger stripes are beginning to appear on the Pecko side one. Also checked my Happy the Man Crafty Hands test pressing and it looks even worse. These were NM.

Still have to go through a lot more stuff but this is going to be a rough night.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Sinsonido » 12 Feb 2019 21:02

So it seems a good part of my collection has been affected by this damage, to varying degrees. I have not play tested any of them yet.

What I've noticed is that every single record that was affected was housed in the inner sleeves I purchased from Bags Unlimited years ago. All of the records that were left in their original inner sleeves have no damage. I'm not an expert in plastics so I have no idea what those liners are made of. It just seems that, under the right conditions, they will begin to damage your records.

Also, these records were being stored in those plastic corrugated boxes, the Ultra Box, also sold by Bags Unlimited. I don't know what those are made of either, and I don't know if they are safe.

I'm not sure what to do next. I'm guessing if I need to store in boxes they will have to be cardboard instead of plastic. I'm hoping that Mo-Fi inner/outer sleeves are safer. If anyone has thoughts or suggestions it would be greatly appreciated.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Trilogy » 15 Feb 2019 06:09

I must have got lucky. Most albums of mine were purchased between 1978 and 1985. Upon opening them I always removed the paper liners and any additional inserts and replaced the paper with the thin flimsy cloudy coloured liners ( marked with A&B Sound in one corner). Then the album itself went into the heavy gauge clear plastic bag type sleeve .

Only recently have I begun to resurrect them after about 25 years of storage. I have yet to find a single issue and am surprised just how good the condition of jacket and vinyl is. They have always been kept in two plain wooden chests with lids that allowed air to move in and out from under the edges. The chests were always kept in a cool basement sitting on 2x4’s in case of a water pipe leak. Good for 3” of water.

Now I bring them up 2 or 3 at a time , inspect, clean thoroughly, dust out the inner sleeve and back in they go for storage upstairs to be accessible.

I think temperature swings, humidity and lack of air movement are the biggest threats. Thinking back 40 years I was always extremely careful handling and playing them and it payed off. Dug my 10cc Deceptive Bends out today and after cleaning it’s like new despite me having played it many many times. It’s creeping up on 50 years old.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Trilogy » 15 Feb 2019 06:17

Just a quick note... if you happen to own Rolling Stones Sticky Fingers put the fly down , particularly if it stored in with a bunch of albums. That way the zipper tag is not pressured against the vinyl but rather the label.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Trilogy » 15 Feb 2019 06:25

Sinsonido wrote:
12 Feb 2019 21:02
So it seems a good part of my collection has been affected by this damage, to varying degrees. I have not play tested any of them yet.

What I've noticed is that every single record that was affected was housed in the inner sleeves I purchased from Bags Unlimited years ago. All of the records that were left in their original inner sleeves have no damage. I'm not an expert in plastics so I have no idea what those liners are made of. It just seems that, under the right conditions, they will begin to damage your records.

Also, these records were being stored in those plastic corrugated boxes, the Ultra Box, also sold by Bags Unlimited. I don't know what those are made of either, and I don't know if they are safe.

I'm not sure what to do next. I'm guessing if I need to store in boxes they will have to be cardboard instead of plastic. I'm hoping that Mo-Fi inner/outer sleeves are safer. If anyone has thoughts or suggestions it would be greatly appreciated.
I would not recommend storing them in plastic bins. It’s not too difficult to build a wooden chest to fit them. Make the two end pieces about an inch taller than the sides and then when you put a good hardwood lid on there is breathing space long both sides. You need the air to move. Jmo.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by milw50717 » 21 Feb 2019 05:20

Sinsonido wrote:
12 Feb 2019 21:02
Also, these records were being stored in those plastic corrugated boxes, the Ultra Box, also sold by Bags Unlimited. I don't know what those are made of either, and I don't know if they are safe..
I use them too and hope they are safe :D

The bagsunlimited website indicate that they are polypropylene. These are the boxes I ordered years ago and they came with a small rectangular 'ultrabox' sticker. No issues so far.
Made from acid-free Polypropylene (plastic). This material is water-resistant, vermin-resistant and antistatic. Excellent choice for long-term storage.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Sinsonido » 21 Feb 2019 22:04

milw50717 wrote:
21 Feb 2019 05:20

The bagsunlimited website indicate that they are polypropylene. These are the boxes I ordered years ago and they came with a small rectangular 'ultrabox' sticker. No issues so far.
I'm not as concerned about the boxes as I am about their "Sound Sleeves". They looked like a good product, but they damaged every record I put them in. I really want to rip them a new one for that. Maybe it was just a bad batch but I would stay away from those if you value your records. I'm looking at MA Recordings next.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by howardpgh » 05 Mar 2019 03:49

This thread is confusing me. What is being discussed? The plastic outer sleeves for the album covers? Or the plastic lined paper inner sleeves for the actual disc. It seems a lot of the older records, mainly classical are in plastic lined paper sleeves. The ones that are in paper sleeves that are bad, I'm replacing with Bags Unlimited S12P white paper poly lined sleeves. I hope I'm doing the right thing for my $1.00 apiece treasures.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by Sinsonido » 07 Mar 2019 18:32

howardpgh wrote:
05 Mar 2019 03:49
This thread is confusing me. What is being discussed? The plastic outer sleeves for the album covers? Or the plastic lined paper inner sleeves for the actual disc?
It's hard for me to distinguish one type of plastic for another, but I think the original concern was those heavy shower-curtain type covers for the album jackets. But based on my experience with Bags Unlimited inner sleeves, those inner liners can cause some damage as well, under the right conditions I guess.

I've heard some complaints about the MoFi inners as well, but personally I haven't had a problem with those, as of yet. My MoFi pressing of The Dark Side of the Moon has been sitting in the same bag for 40 years and still looks pristine. Maybe it's just a QC issue, but it seems kind of important.

I've been replacing all my inners with MA Recordings sleeves. It's a different formulation with a texture that doesn't wrinkle up against the vinyl. It's still made out of plastic though. Can't seem to get away from it.

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by poutrew » 10 Mar 2019 04:47

Sheesh... it's starting to sound like any form of plastic can cause damage if the conditions are right, and we wont know what conditions apply to a particular type of plastic until you see / hear the damage :shock: I've been slowly replacing the paper inner liners of my albums with the Bags Unlimited S12P paper / poly inners... maybe I should have just kept all those old paper inner liners that came with the LPs? So far, I have detected no damage, but it does cause one to worry... :(

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Re: Can PVC record sleeves damage vinyl - Merged Thread

Post by vagli » 15 Mar 2019 05:52

Greetings to all! I am from Kiev, Ukraine. I have a small store of vinyl and related products. I often bring vinyls for sale. Recently, about half a year ago, one person came to me and brought a pack of vinyl records. You will not believe, but he had first-press editions of both the Beatles and Pink Floyd, and Led Zeppelin, and Doors, and many more different ensembles and soloists, which are very, very difficult to find as M or M- today. The vinyl sleeves were immaculate, but the vinyl itself! ...
As the owner of this vinyl explained to me, the records had lain in his closet for almost 30 years without any movement in the stack.
On the plane of the vinyl were dull stains and traces of the folds of the bags in which this vinyl was wearing! When I put several vinyl on the player, instead of habitual sounds of vinyl, such as crackling and so forth, I heard a constant extraneous spike, which continued continuously from the beginning of the recording to the very runoff of the tracks.
Just simply there was a diffusion of PVC in vinyl, which killed these records.
Neither the washing of this vinyl in an ultrasonic washing machine, nor other methods and attempts to clean this damaged vinyl gave any results ...

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