Best record cleaner and anti static system???

how clean is your house
wolfie62
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by wolfie62 » 18 Jun 2019 23:06

$15 system, purchased at Walmart, 6 minutes from filthy to clean and static free, dry, dust free, and playing on the table. And that cost covers hundreds of records.

ilyavictoria
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by ilyavictoria » 19 Jun 2019 03:45

Which one? They have few around $15.

vince1
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by vince1 » 19 Jun 2019 03:55

Nonsense, cheapest is not necessarily the best. We've studied and scientifically evaluated most all devices in a laboratory setting..nothing beats US followed by RCM. Then again, the cleaning solution is cheap and the best...Quat solutions are pennies per gallon and outperform anything on the market (except for those we've consulted on and are marketed using the same formula).

wolfie62
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by wolfie62 » 19 Jun 2019 05:05

Nonsense! Expensive is not necessarily the best. RCM is not the best. Vacuum is not the best. Quat is not the best for all dirt, all surfaces.

Who needs a laboratory setting?? I can tell if it’s clean using my line contact styli and system on playback! Like an electron microscope! Same for static, lint.

So, you use a lab to compare and examine every inch of groove?? Before and after? Don’t insult our intelligence by saying you do! How long does that take you? Electron microscope?? What is your standard of “cleanliness?” How do you measure “cleanliness?” I developed and designed an automated cleaning process for aluminum substrates used in the aerospace industry for precision optics. Don’t think you can BS me!

I do examine every inch of every groove in my lab! I use 1000X magnification! 100X by my preamp, 10x more by my power amp!!

You’re not impressing me.

ilyavictoria
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by ilyavictoria » 21 Jun 2019 04:14

Vince1 is not selling anything as far as I know. Whatever he recommends is actually cheaper then anything you can buy.
Guy who makes VPI turntables is of the same opinion, US and then vacuum. He does not make US.

wolfie62
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by wolfie62 » 21 Jun 2019 13:28

ilyavictoria wrote:
21 Jun 2019 04:14
Vince1 is not selling anything as far as I know. Whatever he recommends is actually cheaper then anything you can buy.
Guy who makes VPI turntables is of the same opinion, US and then vacuum. He does not make US.
Quite the contrary. He is selling the idea that US, Quat, and vacuum removal are the cheapest/best way to clean vinyl. Not best or cheapest by a long shot!

Fact is, for “vacuum removal,” it has been proven that the capillary attraction of water to micro fibers is several orders of magnitude greater than the vacuum force used by any machine out there. A further, and tremendous advantage, that Microfiber has over vacuum is that Microfiber does not entrain airborne dirt and dust and deposit it right back onto the “clean” record surface! Another advantage is speed; Microfiber is much faster for removing water. Cost: Microfiber is SO much cheaper than vacuum equipment. Static: High velocity air moving over the vinyl surface induces a static charge on the vinyl! Moist Microfiber produces no static at all on the vinyl record surface.

dysmike
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by dysmike » 21 Jun 2019 22:26

microfiber tends to shed.

wolfie62
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by wolfie62 » 21 Jun 2019 22:47

Microfiber is made of long threads. Cotton sheds. Not microfiber. Carbon brushes shed. And break. Not microfiber. Carpets and rugs shed. Vacuum systems pull all that airborne debris onto your records.

dysmike
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by dysmike » 22 Jun 2019 03:08

Whatever. Nothing I can say would make a difference. That is clear.

Anyone else that's interested Google "microfiber shedding pollution".

vince1
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by vince1 » 22 Jun 2019 13:21

Someone can't comprehend. I clearly stated that "cheapest is not necessarily the best". The OP asked what was the "BEST" and I gave an answer based on 30 years of scientific research and industry consultation. If you are happy with $15 Wallmart rags, then go to it. Statements that electron microscopy can somehow be used to examine records cleanliness are ridiculous. Do you have any idea what the sample preparation would do to a record for this procedure? The electron micrograph "needle in groove" video of such that was produced and distributed recently on-line was fabricated and admitted as such. Regardless, we do not base our results on physical appearance alone. We measure a wide variety of properties, including static (using the pictured charge analyzer). Static charge is an easy problem to solve and definitely involves NO dry material contact (like rubbing with a cloth). Hospitals, Laboratories, Technical clean rooms, and industry all use quats to control static. They are the active ingredient in commercial products like Staticguard, Hair conditioners, and Clothes Dryer sheets. I have shared my research on this with audio enthusiast for free for years and have never sold anything directly. While I have profited from consultations with commercial applications, I do not mention these products or sell them. Rather, I have provided recipes using commonly obtainable ingredients for enthusiast to make their own solutions that are as good or better than what is out there. Unfortunately, it seems many want to remain ungrateful and argumentative so I will stop. Good luck to all and happy listening.
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sturgus
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by sturgus » 22 Jun 2019 15:16

vince1 wrote:
22 Jun 2019 13:21
Someone can't comprehend. I clearly stated that "cheapest is not necessarily the best". The OP asked what was the "BEST" and I gave an answer based on 30 years of scientific research and industry consultation. If you are happy with $15 Wallmart rags, then go to it. Statements that electron microscopy can somehow be used to examine records cleanliness are ridiculous. Do you have any idea what the sample preparation would do to a record for this procedure? The electron micrograph "needle in groove" video of such that was produced and distributed recently on-line was fabricated and admitted as such. Regardless, we do not base our results on physical appearance alone. We measure a wide variety of properties, including static (using the pictured charge analyzer). Static charge is an easy problem to solve and definitely involves NO dry material contact (like rubbing with a cloth). Hospitals, Laboratories, Technical clean rooms, and industry all use quats to control static. They are the active ingredient in commercial products like Staticguard, Hair conditioners, and Clothes Dryer sheets. I have shared my research on this with audio enthusiast for free for years and have never sold anything directly. While I have profited from consultations with commercial applications, I do not mention these products or sell them. Rather, I have provided recipes using commonly obtainable ingredients for enthusiast to make their own solutions that are as good or better than what is out there. Unfortunately, it seems many want to remain ungrateful and argumentative so I will stop. Good luck to all and happy listening.

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Vince, I for one am quite happy and grateful for your contributions. Keep up the good work.

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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by MostlyHarmless » 23 Jun 2019 01:59

I have watched several VE threads go off the rails recently. This one seems to be another.

This forum has been (is usually) a model of decorum. It seems to me of late, we are too quick to argue. A measure of the times, I suppose. Can we disagree? Certainly, but is there need for such emotion?

Let it go. All of us can contribute; that is the value of this place.

wolfie62
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by wolfie62 » 23 Jun 2019 03:09

Someone can't comprehend. I clearly stated that "cheapest is not necessarily the best". The OP asked what was the "BEST" and I gave an answer based on 30 years of scientific research and industry consultation. If you are happy with $15 Wallmart rags, then go to it. Statements that electron microscopy can somehow be used to examine records cleanliness are ridiculous. Do you have any idea what the sample preparation would do to a record for this procedure? The electron micrograph "needle in groove" video of such that was produced and distributed recently on-line was fabricated and admitted as such.
Very condescending and completely off base. But you don’t want to argue. I just stated fact. No arguments from here.

You have quite the superior attitude. But not superior data or facts.

I never said anything about “$15 Walmart rags.” But we are superior, aren’t we?

And I said earlier “don’t insult us by saying you do” use electron microscopy to judge cleanliness of vinyl. I said that because, despite what you think, there are many of us who already know that that technology does not work on organic substrates.

My whole point is this: cleanliness and degree of static charge can be HEARD. Duh! If it couldn’t, why are we discussing this here? So, since it can be heard, cleanliness and static can be judged. I have a nice US cleaner I bought 20 years ago. Haven’t used it on records in over 12 years. Don’t need to. I can get the records at least as clean without it.

I never said anything about wiping any records with a dry cloth. Another condescending remark that is totally not necessary, not accurate, and not called for. Your sense of superiority is quite sickening.

I did say that moisture is the enemy of static buildup. It conducts, lubticates, and prevents static buildup on vinyl. But no, I never spray or use water on the vinyl surface.

I’ve been using the same dense microfiber material (the same individual piece) to remove lint prior to needle drop for the last 15 years. If “shedding “ were a real “thing” from microfiber, it would be nub by now. False information about the “shedding.”

For one of my tests for effective lint removal on my vinyl surface, prior to needle drop, I use a green laser horizontal across the record surface. Any lint or very fine debris glows brightly. Very brightly! After using microfiber, that same record surface is completely free of surface lint and debris. I take a cellophane strip and check for attraction or repulsion from the record surface. Neutral. I also use small styrofoam beads to check the same. Neutral.

Low tech, and inexpensive, very often tops the performance of high tech and expensive methods.

If that were not true, NONE OF US would be discussing this!! Why?? Because playing vinyl is low tech, compared to digital music recomposition! And many of us can hear it’s superiority over digital recreations of music.

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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by hruki » 27 Jun 2019 13:12

wolfie62 wrote:
18 Jun 2019 23:06
$15 system, purchased at Walmart, 6 minutes from filthy to clean and static free, dry, dust free, and playing on the table. And that cost covers hundreds of records.
I would like to know too. Hunting for a good and cheap way to clean records. I plan to try more than one of those economical ways to make my own idea of what they do.

So, which Walmart are you using and would recommand? Thanks a lot!

Dimal
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Re: Best record cleaner and anti static system???

Post by Dimal » 27 Jun 2019 14:24

Personally, I'll stick with vince1's advice. He has displayed his professional approach and years of experience coupled with a very positive attitude and his desire to place his knowledge and experience at the beck and call of we fellow VE-ers; to our benefit.

Very much appreciate your work vince1... 8-)

Mal.