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Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 21 Jun 2019 03:42
by philbrown
The artist pays for EVERYTHING. Every dollar is recouped from sales. All those big advances you read about? That's what they are: advances.
And aside from normal commercial law the contracts state that recordings are work for hire.
Phil Brown

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 21 Jun 2019 07:03
by H. callahan
Phew, so the artist only works for hire, has to pay for the materials he needs to work for hire (like tape for example) and in the end he doesn´t own any rights of his work. That´s...

On the other hand if these artists whos masters have been lost in the fire start a case, what can they plead for? If they don´t own any rights of their masters going to court should be in vain.

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 21 Jun 2019 15:10
by philbrown
Right. To quote Robert Johnson, "All your love's in vain."
Sure, the game is rigged but it was the only game in town.
Phil Brown

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 22 Jun 2019 07:25
by H. callahan
Seems like the laywer now intending to go to court doesn´t know this...

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 23 Jun 2019 17:21
by philbrown
The argument-because I've heard it many times-is that the recordings were not true works for hire.
Hasn't worked yet to my knowledge.
Phil Brown

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 23 Jun 2019 21:27
by Sinsonido
I've heard Nirvana mentioned a number of times (not here but elsewhere) among the many who suffered losses at Universal. There may be other Universal artists that this sort of thing applies to but I was wondering about a couple of specific things....

A vinyl reissue of Nevermind was released a number of years ago by the Original Recordings Group (ORG) and cut by mastering engineer Bernie Grundman. This ORG release is widely believed to have been cut directly from the original master tapes. It is also widely regarded to be the best sounding release of the album Nevermind, with original ORG pressings selling anywhere from $50 to $200 recently. But here's the thing: ORG released the Bernie Grundman mastering of Nevermind in early November of 2009, well over a year after the fires burned at Universal. This time discrepancy would suggest that at least one good sounding source exists for the album Nevermind that escaped the catastrophe at UMG, but there are a few things we don't know about it. Did Bernie Grundman work directly from the "Original Master Tapes" as we have been led to believe, or did he use a tape copy? And if the tapes were returned to Universal after the fire, where are they being stored now? Or did Bernie cut from a digital file after all? Maybe this is a small amount of good news for Nirvana fans but hard to tell when you have no idea what's going on, and....

How did Nirvana's In Utero get a remix in 2013 if those tapes were incinerated years before its release? I'm looking at my copy now, cut to 45rpm, and the hype sticker says, "Direct Metal Mastering from Analog Tapes". The original mix was cut to 45rpm also. So how did this happen if the tapes were "lost forever"? Did Steve Albini have the multi-tracks and tape copies of the original mixdowns? Were these records cut from analog tape or were they cut from digital files backed up to hard disk years ago?

I've asked about this elsewhere but haven't received much of a response. People are preoccupied with outrage and that's understandable. It's also at least eleven years too late. That was a huge fire, and it's hard to believe all Universal had to respond with was Nothing to see here, folks and everyone forgot about it. Or witnesses were paid off and threatened. Either way it's too late.

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 23 Jun 2019 21:37
by philbrown
Sinsonido wrote:
23 Jun 2019 21:27
I've heard Nirvana mentioned a number of times (not here but elsewhere) among the many who suffered losses at Universal. There may be other Universal artists that this sort of thing applies to but I was wondering about a couple of specific things....
Much snipped...

I know a little about this. Among other things, I worked in the actual room that cut the Sub Pop versions. It was a master lease from Sub Pop so the tapes didn't belong to Uni.
Phil Brown

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 24 Jun 2019 02:26
by vinyl master
Just curious, too, but since the actual masters of many of these artists are gone, would that make any quality records and/or reissues from those artists that were made from THE ORIGINAL MASTER TAPES before the said fire MORE VALUABLE due to the fact that the masters are now gone? :-k

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 24 Jun 2019 02:44
by philbrown
Yup. Or even better, good refs.

Phil Brown

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 24 Jun 2019 05:23
by H. callahan
philbrown wrote:
23 Jun 2019 17:21
The argument-because I've heard it many times-is that the recordings were not true works for hire.
Hasn't worked yet to my knowledge.
Phil Brown
I see.

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 24 Jun 2019 12:54
by Peter Galbavy

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 25 Jun 2019 19:09
by vinyl master
Looks like they'll be paying dearly for their mistake now! Reminds me a little of the Flint water crisis here in Michigan...Not to compare the two BY ANY MEANS, but there was a similar lack of accountability for the consequences of their actions and immeasurable losses due to gross negligence...And lawsuits followed!

https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/19/us/flint ... index.html

I hope these acts show others what can happen when companies, individuals and organizations become short-sighted about what's REALLY important and inspire them to do what's right in the first place!

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 26 Jun 2019 02:09
by philbrown
There is a new piece in the New York Times Magazine on the fire that just posted in the New York times. It has a list, incomplete I fear, of the affected artists. But don't worry about Neil Young. His masters are in his facility in Redwood City.
Phil Brown

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 26 Jun 2019 16:19
by fscl
philbrown wrote:
26 Jun 2019 02:09
There is a new piece in the New York Times Magazine on the fire that just posted in the New York times. It has a list, incomplete I fear, of the affected artists. But don't worry about Neil Young. His masters are in his facility in Redwood City.
Phil Brown
Is this the list you've referenced

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/11/us/m ... ion=Footer

The link to the original article mentioned many of the artists too.

Another article

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/12/us/u ... ion=Footer

To think that all of JC's masters are gone forever...... :(

Impulse ! https://www.npr.org/templates/story/sto ... Id=5452186

Fred

Re: The Day The Music Burned

Posted: 29 Jun 2019 16:29
by fscl
The list of hundreds....... :cry: #-o ](*,)

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/25/maga ... Position=1

Fred