Dual Service

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tplate
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by tplate » 22 Feb 2016 23:01

Thanks dualcan and audiopile for the replies. I've found a somewhat local experienced repair person that identified it as most likely dry lube as well. Looking forward to having it serviced and back into operation soon.

audiopile
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by audiopile » 23 Feb 2016 01:07

Keep this in mind - it has taken DECADES for these tables to get to this state . If well serviced and used at least pretty regularly -it will very likely be some more decades before anything like this level of servicing will be required again.These are remarkably well designed and built turntables.

realnuts
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by realnuts » 23 Feb 2016 12:01

these manuals are the reason i joined vinylengine
thank you so much!

jdjohn
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by jdjohn » 12 Mar 2016 04:00

If you have ever wondered what old, clumpy, or even dry grease looks like, see the attached pics. One shows dark, gummed-up grease, and the other shows dried grease (e-clip has been removed in the foreground). These were from the start/stop mechanism on a 1215-S.
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mummyjohn
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by mummyjohn » 13 Mar 2016 22:29

Haven't seen a confident answer to this elsewhere, so I'll ask here: can 'white lithium grease' (such as the ubiquitous Lucas oil variety seen at hardware stores http://lucasoil.com/products/grease/whi ... ium-grease) reliably be used in place of the Shell Alvania/Gadus that's formally suggested? I ask since I'm having a devil of a time sourcing the Shell.

vuilleum42
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by vuilleum42 » 20 Mar 2016 19:53

Hi everyone, I have a Dual CS 504 Turntable and I'm looking for a service manual in English.

I downloaded the one in the downloads section, Since I can't read German, it's kind of useless to me ...

Has anyone found an English version of this Manual ??

Hugues TR4
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by Hugues TR4 » 20 Mar 2016 20:29

Hi mummyjohn,

Got a 400 grms container of Shell Alvania/Gadus for €17,49, incl shipping to Belgium on e-bay. Actually, the original name of Shell Alvania has been changed to Shell Gadus. If you google "Shell Gadus", you will get access to a lot of sites which sell the stuff.
This is the real stuff, with which you don't take any risk (compatible with plastics, which is paramount important for the cam), etc...
I know 400 grms is a lot but it will be enough for the next fifty Duals you will service in your present (and maybe next life!)
Hope this helps,

Cheers, Hugh.

vanvlackd
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by vanvlackd » 20 Mar 2016 22:17

This is a great post. Your work is wonderful. I have a Minerva cabinet that uses tube style power and a Dual 1010. Coming off the transformer is 220 volts. In Italy, the turntable played wonderfully. But since shipment and arrival here in the United States, it doesn't stay running. I have looked over the mechanism and it is running smoothly. It isn't gunked and it appears to be oiled well. It could use a cleaning but I guess my point is, I don't think that is the issue. Without an album n place it spins up but then when the switch reaches from auto to stop area, it spins down. I can hear the motor wheel spinning but the table isn't rotating. I have read about 50 or 60 hertz parts but to be honest, I don't understand what the difference is. I have thought about switching this to 110v and plugging direct to wall power but I'm not sure that is a good idea (assuming I switched the voltage to 110v). Any thoughts or suggestions? I would gladly ship the turn table to someone for repair in the U.S. if I thought it would help. I am in Dallas/Fort Worth Texas. Thanks. Dave

dualcan
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by dualcan » 20 Mar 2016 22:55

Hi,
Since you describe that the turntable is connected to a 220 volt tap of the radio, the voltage change should be made on the radio to 110, leaving the turntable on the 220 transformer tap.
The problem with the 50 to 60 Hertz is another matter. You will need to find a 60 hertz pulley for the unit.
There are four different 1010 units:
1010, 1010A, 1010S and 1010F
Depending which unit you have, the pulley will be different. As well all the units usually had two motor options, each motor with a different pulley again. All this makes things more difficult, besides the unit being fifty years old, with parts hard to get.
Check out which 1010 version you have- it is marked on the chassis near the tonearm. Later look under the chassis to see which motor it uses.
The problem with the speed is firstly related to the old idler wheel which drives the platter via the motor.
A unit of this age needs to be completely overhauled if it is to perform as it once did.
Regards,
k

vanvlackd
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by vanvlackd » 21 Mar 2016 01:53

Do you know someone who could do complete overhaul? I could build a nice wood box for it and ship? It would just be the turntable. It would still come off the 220 tap? It has a step up transformer that feeds the table at 220v with the power setting switch (not the table one) at 120V.

seamonster
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by seamonster » 21 Mar 2016 14:07

I'm not associated with them; Bill serviced my CS5000 a few years ago.

http://www.fixmydual.com/

tlc630
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by tlc630 » 23 Mar 2016 19:11

Might I make a small suggestion that hopefully will make it into the "Motor and Drive System" document.

I have serviced several Duals recently, mostly 1019s and 1229s, including motor rebuilds. The first time I drilled out the rivets in the motor, I drilled from the outside of the shell inward bending the thin aluminum cap that holds the felt oil retainers and copper thrust plate in place and forms a seal with the outer steel shell. I was eventually able to flatten the bent flange to my satisfaction but ever since I drill from the inside of the shell out. I really think the preferred direction is inside to outside. If this observation could be incorporated into the doc it might help future DIYers.

dualcan
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by dualcan » 23 Mar 2016 20:32

Yes, removing the rivets can be updated. I don't drill them any more but use a flat-nose nipper on the inside to crush and nip the old rivets. I also use pop rivets to re attach the parts to the bell. Using rivets avoids the possibility of the nuts coming loose over time. If nut and bolts are used, they should be sealed with some lacquer or glue to seal.
Given time, there are many new items to be included in this folder..
Regards,
k

Hugues TR4
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by Hugues TR4 » 23 Mar 2016 21:02

I use bolts and nuts, with self tightening "nylock" type nuts. Found tiny ones, only trouble, they are very tight indeed and sometimes difficult to use with a small screwdriver.
No loosening so far and very convenient if something goes wrong at the end of the motor servicing, you can always go back in your repair sequence.
Cheers,

Hugh.

wasurrette
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Re: Servicing Dual Turntables - Revised

Post by wasurrette » 09 Apr 2016 15:24

I have a dual 1219 purchased in 1970 while overseas. I am trying to get it back to perfect working order....but having a problem with the cam follower lever....I have cleaned and re-lubed the cam, and cleaned the cam follower lever which over time had accumulated grease....the spring (which has to be the smallest thing ever manufactured by man) appears to be slightly worn....one of the legs is smaller in diameter than the other leg....but I can get it all back together, and remounted into the unit. But I can't tell if there is enough tension on it to do it's job. Also, when I took the lever off the cam, there was oil on the shaft. The instructions I have read say not to lube the shaft. When watching the turntable cycle, it appears the lever should be set via the locking slide. It does touch it, but it doesn't change the position of the lever. that in turn makes the tone arm mechanism fail to begin it's cycle.......so should I put a drop of lubricant on the shaft.....or try to find another spring, which I am sure is probably impossible by now. I can feel the snap of the lever when I test it manually, but there is no way of knowing if that is sufficient to do it's job. What I can't tell is if the snap back and forth is normal or should the spring cause the lever to snap back to it's original position during the normal cycle. I hope I haven't been too ong winded with this. Any help is appreciated. I have hundreds of vinyl from the 50's, 60's, and 70's to put on disk....

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