Questions about lubration specs'

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Dual Wielding
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Questions about lubration specs'

Post by Dual Wielding » 09 Jun 2019 13:26

In the Dual 1229 it mentions "Wacker siliconoil AK 300 000" as well as 500 000.

I'm having trouble finding out what 300,000 means and how to find a local equivalent. After some googling it seems like the 300 000 means wt or weight, which is an old unit which is not standardised. However, I also found this page about the actual brand ..

https://www.wacker.com/cms/en/products/ ... duct=13795

It says that the "Viscosity kinematic at 25 °C is approx. 300000 mm²/s". So it says mm²/s instead.

I tried looking for stores that sell silicone oils here in Perth, WA and the unit of measurement is often cst (centistokes).

So .. I'm confused.

Basically all I want to do is find two silicone oils which are equivalent to the wacker 300 000 and 500 000 from a local hardware store or something.

If somebody could dumb it down to an equivalent cst rating or something that would be much appreciated.

Thank you!

mrow2
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Re: Questions about lubration specs'

Post by mrow2 » 09 Jun 2019 18:05

Look for a P.M. from self, but short story is that the community has pretty much settled on R.C. transmission/ differential/whatever siliconol oil for use here, and that small bottles of the stuff (lifetime supply X 40) will restore the functions of manual tonearm lift issues. I've rarely removed the old, it just mixes in. Agree, 300,000 and 500,000 would give options for a lot of models, and if you are wanting to own others, a bottle of 100,000 (possibly instead of the 300,000) would give you all the options you need (for the Japan models etc). Will be interesting to see if I am out of step here, others will correct me if my info is outdated or something (¿better?) has come along. This info and a whole lot more is in my PDF. According to what I've been able to determine, full understanding of cst ratings and the like may be over-thinking it a bit when we can get hold of these products. Cheers, Don

P.S. This stuff is awful when it gets on your hands! Consider using those thin latex gloves which are available...everywhere.

musicmn
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Re: Questions about lubration specs'

Post by musicmn » 09 Jun 2019 22:56

Hi agree with Don, after servicing numerous Dual turntables over the last couple of years I use 500,000wt Kyosho brand silicone damping fluid (available on ebay) in the cue mechanism. I have found 500,000wt to give the best response to lowering the tonearm slowly onto a record. After I remove the cue bolt/piston from the housing I Put a small glob (for lack of a better word) of the new damping fluid inside the cue housing from the bottom. I made my own long thin flat wooden paddle to apply the damping fluid. Then insert the cue piston back into the housing and move it up and down and twist it to evenly spread the damping fluid over the piston. Assemble the cue mechanism just enough so you can test the drop rate of the tonearm with the cartridge and counter weight installed back onto the tonearm. There really is no way to tell you how much damping fluid to apply. It's a trial and error type of service especially if you have never done this service before. I hope this helps.

Dual Wielding
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Re: Questions about lubration specs

Post by Dual Wielding » 11 Jun 2019 00:37

Thanks Guys

I managed to find a place in Australia that does have the two specific silicone oils in a small quantity.

Next question is about the Alvania grease. I've done a little bit of research and found out that this is a "lithium hydroxystearate" grease. I've tried googling for brands of this grease but I'm not finding much information other than a national company that deals on an industrial level with Mobil brand greases, no retail information.

I suspect that I don't need to be fussy about finding an exact match for this grease. Is there a more common one that you can recommend which would be available from a local retailer?

I do already have a can of "3 in one" brand white lithium grease. I read the labeling but it doesn't say what that contents are so I can't identify what specific grease it is. It's has a spray nozzle and comes out a bit foamy. I sprayed some of that in a small cup and stirred it to get the air out before using a q-tip to put some into the main cam channels. I was thinking of taking it out because it dries out a little a looks a bit ugly, not clear like the old alvania grease that was in there.

mrow2
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Re: Questions about lubration specs'

Post by mrow2 » 11 Jun 2019 01:19

The white lithium is not the best replacement, and doesn't mix well with Alvania which is already in the turntable. I sent you a P.M.; there's some info there. Alvania is a kind of amber in color, and is plastics-safe. The foamy stuff isn't going to work well with the steuerpimpel and main lever; and isn't the right consistency for the large cam. Won't hurt anything, but it's not right for the large heavy models. I used lithium (paste) in a little steuerpimpel video I posted, but that was a 1254 I think, at any rate it was one of the lightweight ULM models and the paste worked ok. It was made before I became familiar with Alvania.

Dual Wielding
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Re: Questions about lubration specs'

Post by Dual Wielding » 11 Jun 2019 14:22

I messaged the state supplier that I mentioned before using their website contact form. They were good enough to email me back with some information which is interesting.

In their email they said "these older basic products are increasingly replaced with Lithium complex type grease. An automotive accessory store will sell small quantities of general purpose EP2 type wheel bearing grease."

I googled lithium complex and found one at on online store ..

https://www.supercheapauto.com.au/p/cas ... 2&start=12

This seems like the go. According to the product data sheet it is a "blue buttery colour" (I was hoping that it isn't black).

musicmn
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Re: Questions about lubration specs'

Post by musicmn » 12 Jun 2019 00:53

Hi Dual Welding, if Super Lube brand grease is available to you use that. In the last couple of years I switched to Super Lube for almost every turntable I service including Duals. The reason I like it so much it that super lube does not dry up or turn hard and it stays where you put it. I had a chance to do a side by side comparison with Alvinia and Super Lube and found no differences with the turntables performances. They were both 1229's by the way. The only thing I will tell you is make sure you remove all of the old Alvinia grease. That way it won't mix with what ever grease you decide to use. If you find a small amount of good clean Alvinia in the mechanism of the turntable you can save that to use on the flat area of the main lift lever for the steuerpimple to ride in. I hope this helps and this will mostly start a war with some members on this forum :-|

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