the home of the turntable

play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

twice the fun

play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby plexi » 16 Dec 2017 07:15

I am hearing a slight speed variation at times. I've lubed central roller bearings on top and bottom. I'm now looking at idler wheel. The screw is on so tight I haven't been able to take off to lube up. i put some the same oil on it and let it sit overnight but still not coming off. Maybe a wd40 penetrating oil would work but not a good idea probably. In any case, i noticed this 1mm vertical play. Should this be gotten rid of by adding a washer thickness in there? I can see where this vertical play could cause audible speed issues since the idler is tapered style. Thanks in advance for any ideas on how to get screw off without stripping and whether that play is abnormal....


https://youtu.be/oQu1GZTEFEY
plexi
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 524
Joined: 12 Nov 2014 00:04

Canada

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby DSJR » 16 Dec 2017 11:00

That's exactly as it should be - leave it alone please :D In practise, the idler doesn't weave up and down on its shaft when running, so there's never an issue with speed wandering.

If you look at the service manual, you'll see that the screw thread on the idler spindle is so you can set height to fine tune the external fine-speed adjustment. It's a very tight nut and I left mine well alone.
DSJR
long player
long player
 
Posts: 2222
Images: 48
Joined: 01 Feb 2009 21:29
Location: Suffolk

United Kingdom

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby dualcan » 16 Dec 2017 17:01

Hi ,
All Dual idlers are are removed by popping them off the stem- that's why you have the vinyl washer holding them on top.
Do not adjust the idler shaft. This is for the inner platter running height available which takes into consideration the maximum speed setting on 78 till the minimum speed on 16 2/3 rpm. The pulley / shaft must be placed within that limitation and that is the reason for the movable shaft.
The non pitch adjustable models usually have this shaft riveted onto the idler arm as the later 1200 series do as well.
Regards
dualcan
long player
long player
contributor
 
Posts: 3347
Images: 88
Joined: 15 Nov 2013 23:53
Location: Sorel-Tracy Quebec

Canada

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby plexi » 16 Dec 2017 22:59

it's not quite clear. doesn't the screw need to come off in order to access and oil the idler shaft? It has never been taken off since new and needs oiling. I need to set fine speed at max to even reach 33.2 rpm and that last extra I need is probably solved if i can oil the idler underneath no? ....also this is likely why screw is so tight (never been serviced in 50 years)......regarding play and height. i will leave it alone but still would like to remove wheel to oil shaft....


regardless. I love this table. My best sounding table yet to my ears for my tastes. exactly what I wanted but was not getting from Lenco and garrard. It has a clear and crisp low end that the other idler mentioned tend to turn into 'onenote bass' in a way. Would love to get this table fine tuned to be my main table...
plexi
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 524
Joined: 12 Nov 2014 00:04

Canada

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby dualcan » 17 Dec 2017 00:16

Hi,
This is the way to take off the idler:
DSC00015.JPG

Always avoid touching the drive parts - idler, speed pulley and inner platter rim that the idler runs on.
As you can see, I am placing my fingers under the idler and using a small screwdriver to push onto the shaft, giving me lift for the idler. Do not touch/turn the shaft. Once the idler is off, clean the shaft and re-lube with a drop of 10w30.
The complete 1019 restoration amongst others can be seen on my web-pages under Service tips. To access, just click the blue ball to the left.
My services for restoration is available, if desired. Simply PM me.
Regards,
k
dualcan
long player
long player
contributor
 
Posts: 3347
Images: 88
Joined: 15 Nov 2013 23:53
Location: Sorel-Tracy Quebec

Canada

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby plexi » 17 Dec 2017 00:36

O k. So Finally got the idler wheel to pull off (was very stuck) and confirmed that the screw does not need to be removed to do this task. If only i'd known that earlier.......

so i cleaned and re oiled the shaft and now it is worse than previous. doesnt spin at all. must not like the oil used. basic bearing oil i got from local turntable servicer that ive used successfully on many turntable parts up until now.,,frustrating
Attachments
2017-12-17 00_10_20-Greenshot.jpg
plexi
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 524
Joined: 12 Nov 2014 00:04

Canada

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby plexi » 17 Dec 2017 02:02

got it working again but linage seems very particular and needs to be just precise to engage with platter.....I need to take off e-clip on linkage and clean all parts up with iso alcohol to get off old oil then find a suitable oil to oil all these parts with. Chainsaw or 10-50 motor oil or seweing machine oil seem to be top recomendations?



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIBFLdl ... e=youtu.be
plexi
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 524
Joined: 12 Nov 2014 00:04

Canada

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby DSJR » 17 Dec 2017 11:53

That looks like perfect operation to me. The platter when in place pushes the idler back a little and into contact with the motor pulley and running with the platter removed results in the behaviour you show - I don't think this is a problem. ONLY if the idler bracket is sluggish due to dried grease should you proceed further at this point. If when running, the platter is easily slowed down, the 'tyre' on the idler edge may need cleaning - it has a very slight radius on the edge by the way and shouldn't be filed 'flat' ideally. Although the platter won't 'jump' to speed as Garrards seem to do, the start time to 33rpm should be fairly quick.
DSJR
long player
long player
 
Posts: 2222
Images: 48
Joined: 01 Feb 2009 21:29
Location: Suffolk

United Kingdom

Re: play in idler wheel 1019 . normal?

Postby plexi » 17 Dec 2017 22:26

Still I think idler shaft and idler motor shaft need cleanin and lube....quick vote maybe on oil:

medium weight (or heavy weight if it exists) sewing machine oil
medium or heavy weight car engine oil
medium weight or heavy weight chainsaw oil

?
plexi
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 524
Joined: 12 Nov 2014 00:04

Canada

Return to Dual