Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

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oldrecords_bl
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Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by oldrecords_bl » 30 Dec 2019 19:34

Howdy y'all! Just recently bought a Garrard 3500 model LP player second hand earlier this year (it's attached to one of those long heavy speaker/cabinet systems) and the needle broke. I'm trying to find any sort of tutorial or instructions on how to replace it and where I might get a replacement needle? Picture of turntable section below.
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Biggest initial stumbling block is there doesn't even seem to be any easy way to lift the needle arm up higher so I can worth underneath it? Total newbie to the retro LP record player space, so any help is appreciated.
thanks!
Chad

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by DSJR » 31 Dec 2019 10:54

Hi Chad,

Are there any labels on the pickup head itself? This is a total long shot, but the flip-under tab on the pickup indicates the cartridge may just be a Garrard KS40A/41b/41C(Sonotone 3509/3559) type - but PLEASE don't hold me to that. if it is, it's one of the better ceramic cartridges around and 'double diamond' styli are readily available for these.

More pics would be great please -

I've never seen a 3500 in that colour scheme before - in the UK we usually had the plain black version. It's worth studying the servicing threads on this Autoslim derived chassis' too of which the 3500 is part and in the library here, there's a good service guide on this model (the arm can't be lifted high as designed).

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by oldrecords_bl » 31 Dec 2019 19:50

Hi @DSJR! Yeah, i can't see any numbers on the easily visible part of the needle/cartridge head. I'm trying to get a mirror small enough to slide under it and see if there are any in there. (Since the arm doesn't lift high enough for me to see under it). Re: the manual, i found a manual on this site that looks like this:
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Is that the one your referring too?

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by DSJR » 01 Jan 2020 01:43

I refer to the one here in the library which looks the same.

Until you take a look at the stylus using a hand mirror or similar, a pic of the cartridge sideways on would be a big help. if you tilt the flip-under stylus with 'flipper' pointing straight down, are there any letters on it? If there are it may help a bit to some of us oldies here.

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by amagasakii » 01 Jan 2020 11:14

I believe that colour scheme is for a Packard Bell console. Based on how narrow the headshell is, I'm going to guess it's a ceramic cartridge on a proprietary mount -- much like my 2025TC with its Astatic 187D (broken, and way too expensive to consider replacing). Not that you shouldn't try, just be careful of the rubber yoke that holds the stylus in place!

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by DSJR » 02 Jan 2020 00:29

The 3500 as standard only catered for a single hole cartridge fixing - and that in the UK at least meant ceramic cartridges. It appears that Garrard and Sonotone had a good thing going at this level and the 9TA-HC as used in the 3000 model a lot, which looks to be pictured in the 3500 manual as picture above as the stylus flag is distinctive in shape. The replacement KS40-41/3509-3559 series restyled the body a bit in black plastic and the profile fitted the Garrard slimline shell well (as did the Acos GP96 used by other manufacturers like hacker in the UK). A70BBen will confirm, but the arm as fitted to the large-format chassis 74M, had a wider headshell with conventional half inch mounts.

I'm interested to know what comes up from this. I'm only going on the location and 'shape' of the stylus 'flipper-flag' sticking out and no idea otherwise. The basic arm design was much better than it needed to be I think and looked very elegant to me.

Apologies to the OP for my Aspergic digressions.

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by oldrecords_bl » 04 Jan 2020 23:43

Okay everyone! I got some pix of the cartridge underneath and to the side via mirror and I also took a full view pix of the system. Does this help narrow it down any?
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packardbell_needle_head.jpg
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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by DSJR » 05 Jan 2020 00:48

Unless I'm mistaken, that's an Acos 104, one of the best last ceramic types made, or something damned close to it. If so, two styli available, one a flip under type (LP and 78), the other a single LP tip without the flipper flag (104 Transcription). Three connectors on the back and very slim. Properly loaded a good sound.

Hope I'm right and good luck... Worth googling the complete model of the stereogram/console to see if any service data comes up. Replacement styli will be part of this...

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by oldrecords_bl » 05 Jan 2020 01:51

Thanks! I do have the flipper version (i can flip the little plastic switch back and forth) So I found this: https://www.surplustronics.co.nz/produc ... gp104-lp78

But this looks like just the needle? Is this all I need or do I have to replace the entire black casing/plastic underneath the white upper part of the arm tip?

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by amagasakii » 05 Jan 2020 03:03

Ooh, that tuner dial is so gimmicky, I love it!

Assuming the cartridge works, you only need the needle. The stylus is held in place by that metal clip (blue); there should be a thin rubber yoke (green) that holds the cantilever.
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Stylus yoke and clip
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The yoke is what connects the stylus to the ceramic elements in the cartridge and can be very fragile now that it's 40, 50, 60 years old. How do I know? I have two dead Astatic cartridges, both of which have a broken ceramic element. One came that way, one was my fault. #-o The one that was my fault broke because the 78 RPM, the automatic cycle on my Garrard was too fast, and the arm dropped onto the record too quickly. New, the cartridge would've survived. 50 years old, not so much. :cry: I digress...

To remove the old stylus, you flip it so the "flip" is halfway between the 78 and LP sides, i.e., pointing up and down (green). Pull up and back on the flip (cyan) to lift it out of the yoke, then pull forwards (pink) to pull the back part of the stylus from under the clip. Reinstall the new stylus the reverse; get the back portion under the clip, lower gently into the yoke, then flip it to LP or 78. (This will make much more sense when you remove the old stylus. :))
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Flip, tilt back, pull forward
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That metal tab at the front of the cartridge might pull forwards and allow the cartridge to drop out of the headshell. The back of it hooks onto a tab, and then you press it back upwards to clip the front in. My illustration isn't that great, so what I'm trying to show is to hook a fingernail under the metal clip at the front and pull it forwards while you gently push the cartridge up and to the back. Once the black tab on the cartridge clears the slot in the clip it should drop down.
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Option 1 - Pull down at front
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On the other hand, the cartridge may un-snap at the back, in which case I would grab the cartridge by the sides at the back and pull downwards.
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Option 2 - Pull down at back
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DSJR knows his carts; I don't! But if you want to verify the cartridge model, there might be a brand and/or number stamped on the side or the top. Again, be gentle, especially around the yoke and the cartridge wiring.

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by DSJR » 05 Jan 2020 11:45

The one as pictured unclips from the front, the rear fixing as regards the below Astatic model, a couple of slots in the bracket the rear clips onto. As said in the great post above, only the stylus may need to be replaced as long as the cartridge hasn't been badly handled (the ceramic elements inside are delicate on these).

We'll need to speak further if the cartridge is faulty or damaged


FOUND IT!!!

The pickup is a 'Astatic/Euphonics u19-11' type - I first found it on the Canadian Astatic ceramic cartridge list (literally hundreds of different types)

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/741d-Astatic ... 4219253444

E9 on the Astatic list -

https://www.canadianastatic.com/ceramic-cartridges.html

Hopefully all you'll need is the stylus and now 'we' seem to know what it is, please make sure it's a diamond rather than the short lived saphire type.

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by oldrecords_bl » 05 Jan 2020 15:59

Thanks for the detailed posts everyone! These help out a ton. I'll start off by ordering the needle, say prayer to the LP gods, and see if I can replace it without somehow burning the entire unit down :) I'll report back when I've gone through the gauntlet.

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by oldrecords_bl » 05 Jan 2020 16:01

Actually, one more question. Given I can't lift the arm up all the way to easily get in to change the needle and/or cartridge due to limitations of the design, is there any tips for the best way to change the thing without having tiny hands or being a surgeon?

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by DSJR » 06 Jan 2020 00:26

Do it sober..... ;)

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Re: Replacing Needle on Garrard 3500 LP Player...

Post by oldrecords_bl » 06 Jan 2020 02:21

That could be problematic then ;)

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