Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

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--Dual1229--
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Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by --Dual1229-- » 06 Oct 2019 03:15

Hello everyone.

I am looking for advice from someone who has experience servicing those Garrard SL95s. Mine is the non B version.
I bought it about a month ago and decided to do the servicing and hopefully get the auto functions for work again. I came across the main cam and noticed that the Spindle Housing (part 141) was stuck. I few whacks from a hammer and I was able to separate both parts. But now comes the issue. The Cam Stud (part 187) is stuck too and no amount of hammer whacks will make it come off. On previous testing I've noticed that the platter will spin an amount of times before getting stuck and the rotations makes the stud nut come out, as if the stud is spinning along with the cam (what makes sense since they're practically glued together.

My questions are: the cam is supposed to spin freely on the stud, right? Also, any tips or ideas on how to make the stud come out?

Here's a picture of the cam as it is right now:

https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_f ... 922/source

Copperhead
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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by Copperhead » 06 Oct 2019 03:36

--Dual1229-- wrote:
06 Oct 2019 03:15

the Spindle Housing (part 141) was stuck. I few whacks from a hammer and I was able to separate both parts. But now comes the issue. The Cam Stud (part 187) is stuck too and no amount of hammer whacks will make it come off. Also, any tips or ideas on how to make the stud come out?
You've probably been using the wrong tool, this might work better.
specialized tool.jpg
(13.18 KiB) Downloaded 63 times
Failing that, try heating the part but not so much so as to melt the alloy. Putting it in boiling water sometimes works well.

--Dual1229--
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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by --Dual1229-- » 06 Oct 2019 03:49

Haven't thought of boiling water. Sorry if the questions sounds basic but I had no idea that a club hammer would produce a different result than a generic claw hammer. I might buy one in the future as I plan on keep buying vintage TTs.

I'll do research and try these methods and report back. Thanks!

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by smee4 » 06 Oct 2019 04:06

Gently heat it with a butane torch.

btw. That 'stud' in the middle is actually permanently fixed to the metal chassis, sort of rivetted over on the bottom side, in some changers, so I hope you haven't torn it out when you hammered it. :(

--Dual1229--
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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by --Dual1229-- » 06 Oct 2019 04:09

smee4 wrote:
06 Oct 2019 04:06
Gently heat it with a butane torch.

btw. That 'stud' in the middle is actually permanently fixed to the metal chassis, sort of rivetted over on the bottom side, in some changers, so I hope you haven't torn it out when you hammered it. :(
Thanks for your reply.

I'm sorry but I didn't understand your statement. Fixed to the chassis? As in it's not supposed to come off the cam? In the service manual they are two separate parts according to the exploded view. I hammered it lightly so nothing got torn or bent.

Edit: Also, do you know if the cam is supposed to spin freely on the stud?

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by smee4 » 06 Oct 2019 04:18

I am describing what is in the Garrard models I have seen, yours might be different. The cam comes off (with a little heating), leaving the axle, what I am presuming you are calling the stud, fixed to the metal plate underneath. It is a small cylinder, the end of which pokes through a hole in the metal plate and is rivetted over on the other side. Not meant to be removed.

Hope yours is different.

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by --Dual1229-- » 06 Oct 2019 04:24

Ah I see. We're talking about different things. The stud that I'm referring too is the center piece that you see in the picture I posted.

5 Min in boiling water and a couple more whacks and it worked! Now to clean these parts an work on the reassembling. Thanks for your help

I hope to have it fully serviced and functional in a couple days so I can post it here on VE.

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by Copperhead » 06 Oct 2019 04:38

--Dual1229-- wrote:
06 Oct 2019 04:24

5 Min in boiling water and a couple more whacks and it worked! Now to clean these parts an


When in doubt get the hammer out. After dogs, a man's best friend. Hope assembly goes okay, I feared the worse once frustration started setting in.

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by pmetro » 06 Oct 2019 23:42

I have recently been servicing a few Garrard models, new to this but some related experience on repair and servicing in other trades On sticking parts I have found some success with penetrating oil. best option is to let it sit overnight. the only tapping with a hammer is to set up vibrations for the penetrating oil to seep into the stuck mechanism. possibly the biggest hammer you want to use is something like a jewelers size. (soft faces mallet, piece of hardwood?)
As most know, the lubricant grease after years turns into a sealer for lack of a better description. getting just a very slight movement of the stuck part means it on the way, more penetrate oil and tapping should free it up enough to be disassembled BY HAND.
Other notes is that these are delicate parts not meant to be hammered or pried as some with the slightest deformation won't work as well as intended to. Using heat, personally I would avoid, that is, a flame misdirected could cause havoc, in other trades, parts may be heat treated to start with so you could be causing damage without any visible changes, you could also effect the temper of springs in mechanisms or distort alignment of levers, change the shape or melt plastic or rubber bushing etc.
The only reference Garrard makes to using heat is with a soldering iron on stepped pulleys attached to motor shafts. Again it's a personal choice. I've heard of the boiling water technique and haven't used it yet as some suggest it on the troublesome idler tires. My only caution here that with mechanisms that employ plastic parts beware ! even boiling temperatures easily distort parts depending on the type of plastics (so that's another reason to the risk factor of an open flame or even the use of a soldering iron that goes off course).
One other note as this is getting wordy, if you can get a part or mechanism removed from the chassis that's stuck , it could be set into an small arbor press, if possible and I realize that it's likely not everyone has one on their bench, to press out the part if necessary.
So generally avoid force, if the parts bits and pieces were hand assembled and greased back in the day then they were designed to take that amount of force. I've had a few instances that the parts are so well stuck that the axle they rotate on instead of being stationary is starting to rotating because they are just staked in place to the adjoining part. Not as the design intended.
The bottom line time and patience are the best tools. IMHO!

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by musicmn » 07 Oct 2019 01:46

HI, I've worked on a lot of these Garrards and the ONLY way to loosen frozen parts like that cam wheel spindle is with heat. Now I'm not talking about a blow torch to heat the parts to where they melt or get distorted. I use a large Weller soldering gun and place the tip of the gun right on the parts to be heated. All you want to do is to melt the old grease so the part can be removed. You heat the parts for 30 seconds to 1 minute and then try to move the part. If it won't move then heat it again and try moving it. Repeat the process until the part comes off with just your hands. NEVER hit any parts of a turntable with a hammer unless you plan on destroying it. These are highly engineered turntables and hitting any part of it with a hammer will do damage to not only the part you hit but anything else attached to the part or anything else on the plinth. You need to be calm and collected when your working on a turntable with this many parts and where they are stuck from old grease. Now heating of the parts only applies to metal to metal contact. If a parts is frozen to another piece with plastic attached to it then you will need to use a combination of lower heat and penetrating oil. But in all the years of doing these kinds of repairs I have only found one penetrating oil that actually works to melt the old grease and work it's way down into the frozen area. That penetration oil is called Kroil creeping oil made by a company called Kano. It's still available but the newer stuff doesn't work as well as the older stuff IMO. I hope that by hitting these parts with a hammer that it has not caused any severe damage. I guess you will find out when you go to assemble it.

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by Copperhead » 07 Oct 2019 02:03

musicmn wrote:
07 Oct 2019 01:46
NEVER hit any parts of a turntable with a hammer unless you plan on destroying it. These are highly engineered turntables and . I hope that by hitting these parts with a hammer that it has not caused any severe damage. I guess you will find out when you go to assemble it.
Just to clarify, I was joking about using a sledgehammer on any part of any turntable. The soldering iron method, and the missus' hairdryer, have always worked for me. Hitting any metal with a hammer will potentially alter its shape.

Heat, of course, apart from melting old lubricant also causes metals to expand and this helps freeing the part.

Penetrating oil is a bit hit and miss as well, pardon the pun, the first ever auto mechanism I tried freeing did not budge even after a week of spraying it with all sorts. Before the internet things took longer to work out.

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by smee4 » 07 Oct 2019 02:21

I use a butane soldering iron, in "blowtorch" mode (i.e. without the tip). Heat can be applied to small areas in isolation and well controlled. As said, heat a bit and try it, heat again, and try again, so you only use as much heat as required. Old grease can behave like epoxy, but quickly lets go with a little bit of heat.

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by pmetro » 07 Oct 2019 02:49

I use liquid wrench as a penetrating oil , haven't had the need to try heat as of yet. It sounds like a alternative if needed, my advisement was for someone who maybe unfamiliar when using different methods of heating parts for freeing parts and the risks involved and cautionary note to possible save them some aggravations of trying to get hard to find parts because of a learning experience gone sour.. Thanks for the clarification of how and what types of heat to use. I also like a bit of humor on the forum and believe me sometime I would also just suggest getting the biggest hammer you have to fix something. But realistically, I have to step away from the bench once and awhile and come back to the problem later.

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Re: Garrard SL95 - Cam Stud

Post by --Dual1229-- » 31 Oct 2019 19:53

Basic catching up:
The Garrard is alive and well. Rocking a basic but competent AT91R. All speeds work well and the platter moves freely.
I didn't have any penetration oil at the moment of the servicing (rookie mistake, I know) but I will keep it mind next time I need to service or repair one of my TTs.
This is thing is a beauty once it starts working as intended.

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