Garrard Lab 80

the jewel in the crown
DasherF
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Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 03 Apr 2019 16:48

I gotta tell ya, if anything is gonna stop me, it's the removal of the platter...
It doesn't have a proper c-clip, e-clip (maybe the slit in one of the rings is an indicator of one), or Holes in the platter for accessing a slotted screw, or WHUT...
I'm sure someone can help on this seemingly simple bump in the road.

Pure_brew
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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by Pure_brew » 07 Apr 2019 17:19

Remove the mat, spindle, then you might want to put a couple drops of penetrating oil between the spindle shaft and platter. Let it sit for an hour.

Then, with help from a friend have someone tap the center spindle shaft with wood dowel/hammer while you pull up on the platter.

Edit: make sure it is mechanically in the off position!

DasherF
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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 07 Apr 2019 17:38

Thanks, PB...I've heard/seen that tap/hammer bit all over. Thought of doing the oil bit, too, but I hadn't seen that yet...I will try that first before I tap anything dry...thanks, again! =D> :D

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DSJR » 07 Apr 2019 21:00

THERE ARE TWO CLIPS!!

The platter and bearing is in two parts. the platter itself and an inner hub which rotates on the bearing shaft.

The C ring holds the inner hub in place - PLEASE DON'T REMOVE THIS if you don't want to lose the five bearing-race balls!

The cast platter is 'held' by friction as it sits on a lightly tapered inner hub (hence the light tapping to remove it), but there's a black C-clip too and this one can be removed first!

The service manual can be downloaded from the library here. they're classic decks now, so proceed with care and caution (the arm lateral bearings are sixteen tiny balls which are not captive, for example)...

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 07 Apr 2019 21:53

Nat was saying the C-CLIP was off it already (say, where DID his post go? Just earlier this week I read it...), but the C-RING was still there.
The 'table's still at work, so no chance of any things being done...
I read a plethora of material in this and other forums about the Lab 80...touchy, yet trusty, she is.
Keep talking, I'm listening!
Thanks to all for the info!

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by A70BBen » 07 Apr 2019 22:55

A caution: Do not bang too hard on the spindle. The hollow tube it sits in is not locked by dcreed sd on the Type A and A70, and will move down into the centre casting if you bang too hard. The result is that the three prongs on the auto spindle won't fully retract, and stacked records won't drop. Don't ask how I know.

Even if you don't care about auto play, if you drive it down too far, the main bearing will bind up. I prefer to use a narrow brass rod and tap on the little rim that rotates with the platter, while s helper lifts up on the platter. The large C-clip has to be removed first.

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 08 Apr 2019 00:28

"Don't ask how I know..." (sounds like the voice of experience talking, to me....? =D> )
Good plan with the brass rod... I'll see what I can find at work.
As I mentioned before, I was told I appeared the large C-CLIP was missing in the first place and then a short discussion about gravity... :lol: I still wonder what happened to our posts about that...
But, yes, lightness and diligence are key to... keeping one's bearings in the cup... 8) thanks, ben!

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 09 Apr 2019 20:47

Aaahhh, the satisfaction...al bearings accounted for...at least I didn't lose any in the process.
I read somewhere to use 2 spoons to gently pry the platter up and off. I also read to lightly lube it...had a handy can of sewing machine oil on the shelf, put a tiny bit above, let it sit a couple minutes and pried lightly. Thanks , Guys!
The idler is dried, but I may try the sandpaper bit just to see if it will help (for now).
Yup, she's dry, needs a good going over (and an idler "retread"). But that's another time...gotta go back to work...
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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by Pure_brew » 23 Apr 2019 01:07

A70BBen wrote:
07 Apr 2019 22:55
A caution: Do not bang too hard on the spindle. The hollow tube it sits in is not locked by dcreed sd on the Type A and A70, and will move down into the centre casting if you bang too hard. The result is that the three prongs on the auto spindle won't fully retract, and stacked records won't drop. Don't ask how I know.

Even if you don't care about auto play, if you drive it down too far, the main bearing will bind up. I prefer to use a narrow brass rod and tap on the little rim that rotates with the platter, while s helper lifts up on the platter. The large C-clip has to be removed first.
I haven't seen it go down, but the center spindle shaft can also be pulled up. I discovered this the other day trying to remove the platter, felt something a little different but I didn't know what had happened until I put it back together. The center spindle was just above the mat.(!) Pushed it back down and all seemed ok.

I'm guessing from your comment that you are referring to locking screws not included in this device? If this shaft can move up AND down, then the mechanism needs a closer look because it would require a way to center it again.

The other thing is that if you do try to remove the platter spindle, you need some good eyes and surgical skills to work down in the hole. You could loose bearings easily - and trying keep the top thrust washer centered for reinsertion of the platter spindle could be challenging. Probably not a good idea.

I'm sure this is likely why removing the entire mechanism from the bottom is recommended for full service. Also, since you cannot get at the bottom thrust bearing for cleaning from the top, then the only way to thoroughly clean it would be to remove everything from the bottom. As mentioned, referring to the manual is important.

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 23 Apr 2019 04:35

PB, does the spindle appear sunken in to you or normal (just curious...)?

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by Pure_brew » 23 Apr 2019 12:27

DasherF wrote:
23 Apr 2019 04:35
PB, does the spindle appear sunken in to you or normal (just curious...)?
Looks normal, works normal. When I pushed the spindle back down, the cir-clip position is just above the platter spindle (like in your photo). If it could go further down, I suspect the cir-clip would rub on the platter spindle and cause serious drag. Appears to be self-centering, but the service manual doesn't show or indicate it (unless I just missed it somewhere).

Still, I wouldn't want to smack any thing too hard to find out if it can go down!
It's the platter spindle that needs a tap for platter removal- not the center spindle (tube).

I usually like to see if I can first get turntables like these running up to consistent speed before attacking other things.

Platter bearings/spindle shaft - clean and lube:
This was really dirty - and yes I did work from the top down, but you cannot get at the bottom thrust washer this way.
Still, this had a really huge effect on wow an flutter. I didn't like sewing machine oil here. Perhaps there is some old wear, because something heavier (20w-50 synthetic motorcycle engine oil) quieted the bearings. I expected that it would cause more drag, but it didn't. Platter spins for about 90 seconds after shut down.

Motor:
I cleaned the bottom bearing/shaft, added sewing machine oil. I did not pull everything out though. Meaning, I did not pull off the motor pulley. I cleaned it up a bit, and the shaft - then added sewing machine oil.

Idler:
I had a rebuilt Idler from Terrys Rubber Rollers that I wasn't currently using. So, this I added. Cleaned the shaft, added sewing machine oil.

All in all it sounds really good! I will likely disassemble more, just to make sure cleaning is more perfect.

I'm curious to see how things go for you.

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 23 Apr 2019 12:52

=D> Thanks for the info and encouragement, Pb!
The idler's pretty dry, but I want to try a scuff-up with sandpaper and clean out the platter, lube the idler post, just to see what else it needs (probably do the spindle area as you suggested, while I'm at it). I pulled the cartridge out, a terminal lead coming from the wiring, so I may to tonearm wiring beforehand. It was brittle as expected. #-o
Now...the time...where did I leave THAT laying (lying...I know) around? 8) :lol: I gotta quit workin', Man, but I love my job too much...

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by Pure_brew » 23 Apr 2019 13:20

DasherF wrote:
23 Apr 2019 12:52
=D> Thanks for the info and encouragement, Pb!
The idler's pretty dry, but I want to try a scuff-up with sandpaper and clean out the platter, lube the idler post, just to see what else it needs (probably do the spindle area as you suggested, while I'm at it). I pulled the cartridge out, a terminal lead coming from the wiring, so I may to tonearm wiring beforehand. It was brittle as expected. #-o
Now...the time...where did I leave THAT laying (lying...I know) around? 8) :lol: I gotta quit workin', Man, but I love my job too much...
Yeah these things can eat up a ton of time. I can't work on it during the week and there are plenty of other things that need my attention on the weekend. Bummer about the wiring. I haven't run into an issue there yet, but I suspect it could happen. Off to work- peace!

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by DasherF » 23 Apr 2019 13:46

Like most of us, I'm sure there's MANY projects going on at once or in the works, waiting their turn...and then...we get links from other friends (thank you, vm!) with more eye candy...>sigh< it's nice... 8) :lol:
Thanks again for the "what-to-do", Pb!

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Re: Garrard Lab 80

Post by Pure_brew » 27 Apr 2019 13:54

FYI, I'm back on the fence concerning the 20w-50 oil on the spindle bearings. "Light oil" is recommended for this TT. Now that the assembly is really clean, and with new ball bearings, it is quiet, and the speed seems constant. However it does sound a bit "tired" as if constantly slow. Run-down time of the platter is about half of what it was. So, I'm thinking there is now more hydrolic drag.

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