Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

the jewel in the crown
Post Reply
JaysoC
Great Britain
Posts: 1
Joined: 17 Feb 2019 11:49

Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

Post by JaysoC » 03 Mar 2019 16:10

Hi all

I've bought myself a Garrand 125SB and it's working pretty well apart from the auto play.

Originally the manual mode worked well and returned the arm to the rest position properly however the auto play didn't work

In my infinite wisdom I've read the owner manual from here and found the pickup lowering position screw as originally, the needle would be dropped at the centre of the record in auto play mode. It thought that if i adjusted this screw it might get me neared to the correct drop point. Wrong!

I think that i might have over adjusted the screw as now the arm won't correctly return to the rest in manual mode and the needle seems to be dropping in random places, sometimes missing a 33 record altogether and mostly still dropping in the centre of the record.

In order to deepen my woes I've checked a couple of posts on here and it looks like it might need a good re-grease (not sure what grease would be best. I'm in the UK) However, when I look at the mechanism and move the auto start lever, everything looks like it moves freely. This post:

https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_f ... 22#p542122

... really was helpful although there is limited movement in the C-D lever but this seems to be dependent on the position of the cam. The screwing in (clockwise) of the pickup lowering position screw seems to make the CD lever move more when the autostart lever is engaged

Can anyone help me get my turntable working properly as i'm pretty happy with the kit and it's got me back into vinyl again.

Is there a service manual for the 125SB?

Thanks
Jason

DSJR
long player
long player
Wales
Posts: 2791
Joined: 01 Feb 2009 21:29
Location: Suffolk

Re: Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

Post by DSJR » 03 Mar 2019 17:34

Seriously, PLEASE don't adjust anything just yet, apart from possibly the screw you adjusted to roughly half way in its travel to start with - there may be marks on the screw (different colour on the threads) to give you an approximate rough idea where it should be set.

ALL your woes will be under the deck plate and there are so many threads here concerning this, all I can beg you to do is trawl though as many as possible. The mechanism is a refined version of that designed for the 1961 (roughly) 'Autoslim' specially tweaked from the SP25 III onwards and they all suffer the same, you'll be pleased (or not) to know. Yes I know yours is belt driven, but the auto mechanism is still related. perhaps some trawling through the SP25 III and IV threads may help.

The main mech plate underneath isn't too difficult to remove and clean. Once as much old grease has been removed, I'd probably suggest the likes of Superlube as a long lasting safe replacement and I'm sure Halfords or a bike shop could supply a small tube of long lasting grease that won't turn to vaseline fairy quickly. PLEASE don't ladle it on, a small light smear is enough usually. The 'locating' curved groove on the mech plate needs a fair smear though. There's what's called the 'friction lever' which when engaged, catches a stud on the arm under-pinnings to move the arm back and forth. I'd leave this with perhaps no more than a finger-wipe of light oil if not actually dry, as the tonearm friction was much reduced in both planes on this generation of decks and greasing this part will only add drag which you don't want really.

The cam under the platter is one item where the trip pawls ought to be clean, dry and 'rattly,' the trip slider must also be kept dry, preferably at both ends and if there's some black grease in the groove under the cam, I'd leave it alone. The stud poking up through the deck plate that locates in this groove must be free to rotate though and apparently some don't! On the bottom of the platter bearing casting, under the grooved section, there will be a tarry remains of an O ring (1.6mm thick but can't remember the diameter - not too tight a fit). This ring has a magical effect on quietening the mechanism down when cycling and I believe it was fitted to all these mechs from the SL65B/SP25 III onwards. Not important, but it adds to the feeling of refinement no end ;)

The motor needs but a few drops of light sewing machine oil top and bottom. *Some* of these mk2 'SL' motors can have the rotor ring magnet and balancing disc come unstuck, but it's not a disaster if that happens, although Garrard did an amazing job on minimising vibration in these motors, also using two types of mounting grommet to support them.

Hope the above is a start. A nice deck to start with and the lower mass tonearm should easily play host to a Rega Carbon (posh AT91) or AT95E cartridge, both tracking at just under 2g and both being better than the not-so-nice Shure 75-6S originally supplied, which upset the tonearm's structural resonances according to a HiFi Choice review on this deck back in 1976...

A70BBen
senior member
senior member
Posts: 789
Joined: 16 Feb 2014 22:56

Re: Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

Post by A70BBen » 16 Mar 2019 22:43

Service manual for 125SB is a supplement to the onr for SP25 Mk 3.

smee4
long player
long player
Posts: 1078
Joined: 04 Jul 2004 08:07

Re: Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

Post by smee4 » 05 Apr 2019 23:59

JaysoC wrote:
03 Mar 2019 16:10
Hi all

I've bought myself a Garrand 125SB and it's working pretty well apart from the auto play.

Originally the manual mode worked well and returned the arm to the rest position properly however the auto play didn't work

In my infinite wisdom I've read the owner manual from here and found the pickup lowering position screw as originally, the needle would be dropped at the centre of the record in auto play mode. It thought that if i adjusted this screw it might get me neared to the correct drop point. Wrong!

I think that i might have over adjusted the screw as now the arm won't correctly return to the rest in manual mode and the needle seems to be dropping in random places, sometimes missing a 33 record altogether and mostly still dropping in the centre of the record.
Do you mean it is dropping approx where the edge of a 45 rpm 7" record would be? This would indicate the record size sensing lever and mechanisms are not working properly.

DSJR
long player
long player
Wales
Posts: 2791
Joined: 01 Feb 2009 21:29
Location: Suffolk

Re: Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

Post by DSJR » 06 Apr 2019 16:17

No. The way the thing works is that the linkage under the arm is 'caught' by the friction lever - light oil only on this part according to the SP25III manual - and moved back and forth. record indexing - or not - depending on the position of the 'selector lever' (SP25 III service manual diagram 17). If this selector lever is sticky or jammed, it won't 'stop' the arm at the various index points, which I believe also includes the end-of-side situation where the arm is taken a little back from the rest and then brought forward into line with it before lowering (as per it's autochanger roots, so the arm is well clear of a dropping 12" record).

smee4
long player
long player
Posts: 1078
Joined: 04 Jul 2004 08:07

Re: Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

Post by smee4 » 06 Apr 2019 23:03

Yes that's what I meant by the 'mechanisms' associated with the size sensing.

DSJR
long player
long player
Wales
Posts: 2791
Joined: 01 Feb 2009 21:29
Location: Suffolk

Re: Garrard 125SB Auto play / automatic play issues

Post by DSJR » 07 Apr 2019 21:04

The only way out is a stripdown of much of the mech underneath, taking plenty of pics as you go, cleaning all the old grease off and replacing with light smears of something like Superlube perhaps, as it appears to work well and with long life without turning to araldite according to poster 'Spinner45' here, unlike the original greases.

Post Reply