Stylus for Grace F9

the thin end of the wedge
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vfmarky
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by vfmarky » 16 Dec 2019 21:44

That’s right, I have a couple of Empires in my odds box, but they don’t have any way of ‘gripping’ the cart body unlike the pn400 or the JVC...

noisefreq
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by noisefreq » 16 Dec 2019 21:45

I made some changes to my vinyl set-up today and I wanted to report my findings.

I've been using the Technics EPS 24C conical stylus whittled down to fit the Grace F9 cartridge body.
I have been VERY impressed by this combination.
It fits well and sounds full and clear and exhibits all the Grace attributes.
But this was only to hold me over until I came up with something more appropriate.

So I decided to get the original stylus re-tipped rather than buy one of the SoundSmith offerings.
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For one thing, I like the look of the neon green stylus (the SS looks chunky to me) and for another, it was $150 cheaper which is always nice.
I used cartridge_ripping-5 on the auction site (AKA needlestein).
Turnaround time was right at two weeks. Fast.
He had an original Grace cantilever and installed an Ogura nude vital line contact diamond.
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First off, the Grace cantilever is about a millimeter longer than the Technics.
And the compliance is MUCH higher as well.
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Which leads to an interesting issue.
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The Grace/EPS 24 was on my AR TA and tested out at around 11Hz resonance on my MarcMorin modified AR/Technics arm with an arm mass @ 13g. The re-tipped stylus tested out at 6.5Hz resonance. Too low.

I moved the newly re-tipped Grace to my Thorens TD145 mkII with an arm mass of 7.5g.
Now it tests out around 8.5Hz, acceptable.
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I'm still dialing in the Thorens arm but the Grace just adds space around the instruments.
I immediately heard things I wasn't hearing before with the conical stylus.
There's more detail and realism to the music.

So if you have a medium weight arm and want to employ a Grace F9, the Technics EPS styli are a great option.
I intend to buy an elliptical EPS for down the road when I put the Grace back on the AR. It's a great combination.

Dyolf
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by Dyolf » 19 Dec 2019 21:15

vfmarky wrote:
16 Dec 2019 04:46
Here’s a curved ball. Will JVC DT 33H stylus do the job here?
It has a round shaft like the pn400...
I spend a weekend last year looking over the various types of round-shafted pickups on eBay, and ended up buying four different makes (not the one you mention though). The only one that I could make to fit the cartridge body satisfyingly, was the Technics. The JVC in your picture has no "side wings" to hold the PU in place. The various Pioneer types also need added tape to fixate. The elliptical Technics is cheap, fantastic sounding, and can be cut to match the cartridge perfectly. What else is there to ask for :D
Steen

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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by Dyolf » 19 Dec 2019 21:24

Thank you noisefreq for your in-depth sharing regarding resonance. Very interesting. You say "much higher" compliance, but do you have any numbers on that? Also, you should really try out the elliptical Technics instead of the conical.
Steen

noisefreq
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by noisefreq » 20 Dec 2019 15:25

The original Grace compliance is around 35cu. I'm guessing the EPS 202 is around 18cu. So the Grace needs a very light arm. I will look for an elliptical and share my comparison to the line contact when I can.

vfmarky
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by vfmarky » 21 Dec 2019 02:25

Hi all, first I’d like wish everyone a safe and happy holiday time. I really enjoy your conversations.
A postscript to my post re the JVC stylus. It’s interesting how things align at times both good and bad. A woman I know handed to me a JVC turntable to play with it’s a JL -F35 and it has the second tier cart, a Z-1s. So full of anticipation I tried fitting the stylus on my Grace F-9 and guess what? It doesn’t fit nearly securely enough - in fact it’s quite loose. So, back to the pn400 or saving up for a Grace re-tip...

vfmarky
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by vfmarky » 24 Dec 2019 04:01

download/file.php?id=47714&mode=view

This is a photo from another thread (the Grace Lovers forum) showing a Sony ND150G fitted to a Grace F8 that has a square shank. It apparently fits like a glove. Wondering whether to give it a try...

Dyolf
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by Dyolf » 24 Dec 2019 13:10

vfmarky wrote:
24 Dec 2019 04:01
download/file.php?id=47714&mode=view

This is a photo from another thread (the Grace Lovers forum) showing a Sony ND150G fitted to a Grace F8 that has a square shank. It apparently fits like a glove. Wondering whether to give it a try...
I assume you want to try it on a F8 cartridge and not the F9 we are discussing in this tread. Two completely different PU's.
Steen

vfmarky
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by vfmarky » 25 Dec 2019 07:43

No no no, Dyolf, you have misread what I posted. I have an F9 and I’m looking via this thread for another stylus to use while I squirrel way $$$$ for a Ruby re-tip. In another thread (The Grace Lovers forum) the Sony ND 150G (that has a square shank) was mentioned as a replacement option. It was however attached to an F8 cart that has a square rather than round opening, so my question was (because the use of square shanks on F9s has been discussed here) what is the groups opinion of the Sony, which appears to have the wings we desire...

vfmarky
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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by vfmarky » 03 Jan 2020 06:12

This is a photo of the Sony stylus I had in mind showing wings which what fueled my interest

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre ... 3458725935

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Re: Stylus for Grace F9

Post by edugom » 19 Feb 2020 13:39

I put a needle of the Sony xl 45, nd 45 in the grace F9 and it sounded good despite being square, only it did not fit well on the sides, somewhat loose. Try also with the needle of the nagaoka mp 110 that similarly is also square but in this case it didn't sound anything, for more attempts I made.

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