I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

the thin end of the wedge
pedroboe
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by pedroboe » 14 Mar 2016 02:07

I thought it would be easier to demo this way. It's totally flaky and unscientific :roll: and I will get flamed, but take a listen with decent headphones and tell me what you think:

Pickering: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yOoChQZxII

P500: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvFv72W8-vw

P500: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0NAaLV5jME

Clearaudio Virtuoso: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYuB1D3lXag

Audio Technica AT 32E: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQzJfSbPFSU

Audio Technica 33PTG: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsLkZvH1l9o

another 33PTG: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xgz3DECffg

LPGear BIN 323: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUzoF3_am-E

LPGear BIN 323: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SL4IXCj1DMw

Audio Technica AT 33EV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb00CdKv6yY

And so on... of course there is no possibility to make a subjective argument, as every recording is different, levels, etc. [-X But your gut might tell you that is more "air", more "there" there. Or you might like the MP500 better? :?:

The only good samples of MP500 on youtube are the ones from Kazu, and those enticed my curiosity, but they are recorded from the speakers with a mic. They sound really good in his room.

Ender Wiggin
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by Ender Wiggin » 14 Mar 2016 08:48

Hi Pedroboe,
I think that the cement on the cantilever is fine, mine is in the same conditions too.
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Ender Wiggin
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by Ender Wiggin » 14 Mar 2016 09:12

About the audio samples, I admit that it's a little difficult for me to evaluate correctly without listening at least at the same music sample with different carts; if you change record, cart (with different hours of play) and music sample, there will be too many variables, IMHO of course.
Anyway it's seems to me that the MP-500 is sounding quite right, maybe a little stiffy.
And I think that it's quite natural that your MC carts (that are quite good) will play with a better soundstage and presence.
If I were you I'd give it some more hours, if you can.
The only "scientific" part is the one about the setting (with the limit of the system, of course, mine like everybody else's). After that, it's just a matter of taste (always IMHO) :D
Bye

Luca

pedroboe
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by pedroboe » 14 Mar 2016 10:06

Thanks Luca. I will recheck the sra, bump up resistance and give more time when I get back. Enjoy your day and thanks for the input.

Pedro

Tonybro
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by Tonybro » 14 Mar 2016 10:15

Also I find the MP500 styli can take a good number of hours to open up. Around 30+ before it gets into the rhythm of things.

Ender Wiggin
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by Ender Wiggin » 14 Mar 2016 10:58

My pleasure, Pedro!!
Thanks and have a fine day you too!!
Bye

Luca

pedroboe
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by pedroboe » 14 Mar 2016 12:43

Ender Wiggin wrote:Hi Pedroboe,
I think that the cement on the cantilever is fine, mine is in the same conditions too.

Looks good. Gotta her me a microscope.

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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by pedroboe » 26 Mar 2016 21:26

Ok, I've been putting a few more hours into the MP500, checking sra, vta, vtf. Operability is perfect, it works great. It's just maybe too laid back and monochromatic for my taste. My system is based on hybrid class D amplification and it tends towards the dry side in terms of SQ. I could envision using this in a vintage system with Japanese electronics and pioneer hpm or Yamaha berylliums. But in a small Manhattan apartment, I only get one shot. So it's going on sale I guess. Thanks to all for your contributions.

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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by AudioSoul » 27 Mar 2016 15:33

I owned the MP-200 once and sold it. My cart. was bright no matter what arm or turntable I used it in. So I sold it, how many hours do you have on the MP-500 now? carts. can take up to 100 hours to beak in. Looking at your photos of the stylus/cantilever and that glob of glue, maybe the glue is partially riding on the groove. I know kind of out here but maybe....

Gigantor2
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by Gigantor2 » 23 Aug 2019 20:15

I’m not impressed with Nagaoka’s glueing on boron cantilevers. I don’t think they drill a hole, they just glue the stone onto the rod. That ugly blob of glue must add a lot of weight. I have not heard the MP500, but I have done a comparison of the MP150 and MP200 and I prefer the MP150. It sounds clearer to my ears. I ended up selling the MP200. As a point of reference, take a look at how the Audio Technica ATOC9’s tip is affixed to its boron cantilever. Much cleaner!
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Gigantor2
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by Gigantor2 » 27 Aug 2019 16:13

The other thing that bothers me about Nagaoka’s boron tube is that the contraption has 3 sections, so technically it’s only 1/3 boron. Not sure what material is used for the other two sections but it looks thick and massive. I have not seen other manufacturers boron cantilevers looking like that.
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dahoo
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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by dahoo » 27 Aug 2019 22:27

Gigantor2 wrote:
23 Aug 2019 20:15
I’m not impressed with Nagaoka’s glueing on boron cantilevers. I don’t think they drill a hole, they just glue the stone onto the rod. That ugly blob of glue must add a lot of weight. I have not heard the MP500, but I have done a comparison of the MP150 and MP200 and I prefer the MP150. It sounds clearer to my ears. I ended up selling the MP200. As a point of reference, take a look at how the Audio Technica ATOC9’s tip is affixed to its boron cantilever. Much cleaner!
audio technica at150mlx has similar glue as mp200/300/500. See the close up in this thread. so i dont think it is a problem.
https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_f ... start=5550

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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by johnnywalker » 28 Aug 2019 12:38

Two thoughts:

First, give the MP-500 plenty of time to break in. One of the carts in my rotation is an MP-200, and it took a good while to perform its best, probably about 40 hours. So be patient. One of the methods I use to break in a cart is to put records on and play them as "background music" - not necessarily close, careful listening, as I usually do.

Second, the 500 (or perhaps any Nagaoka) may not be to your taste. Our hobby is highly personal and subjective, and not all listeners like all cartridges. You may not care for the Nagaoka "house sound." That's okay - go on to the next choice, maybe something you will like better!

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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by lakeallen » 08 Oct 2019 18:29

Late to the conversation but... I'm now a full-on Nagaoka fan. I'm on my second MP-300 stylus after listening to 100's of records and love this cart. Beats my Hana SL!

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Re: I am close to giving up on nagaoka mp 500

Post by Spencerfrater » 26 Nov 2019 21:03

Also late to the conversation, but I found this thread extremely useful. In order to soothe the minds of new purchasers of this cart I’ll let you know my experience. I was incredibly disappointed at first.
I played with literally everything, VTF, azimuth SRA/VTA, effective arm length, anti-skate. After much persevering I have learnt the following, which I hope will help new purchasers of this cart. As succinctly as possible:
VTF at the higher end of the 1.3-1.8g range. I settled on 1.74g
VTA/SRA slightly negative (below the 92 degrees you’re supposed to have when the arm is level). My arm is now sloping slightly towards the pivot. I’m not sure what the exact measurement is but the slope is noticeable, but not significant, if that makes sense. I found this makes a material difference to the sound quality: the difference between disappointment and awe.
Lastly, give this cartridge time. It continues to improve and I’m on around 25 hours.
It’s well worth it. Sounds amazing now.