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Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

the thin end of the wedge

Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby jdjohn » 10 Nov 2016 16:56

ray_parkhurst wrote:I have a fairly advanced photomacrographic setup that I put together for imaging coin varieties (mintmarks, etc). I use the setup to do both 2D high res images as well as 3D renderings. I have tried 3D renderings of styli but lighting is too difficult and it's hard to see what the surfaces really look like. More traditional 2D lighting is still way better for showing the proper shadow and highlight details to properly view such a complex shape.

If you want to see some similar setups, and images I've taken of full coins and varieties, at my website http://www.macrocoins.com

Wow, amazing images of those coins! My dad used to have a lot of wheat pennies and Mercury dimes that he kept from his paper route collections as a kid. But he 'stored' them in a sock that he knotted, so not exactly mint/uncirculated.
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby ray_parkhurst » 17 Dec 2016 04:56

Thanks John! Took me a while to see the reply for some reason.

As I have viewed and imaged several cartridges, and viewed their contact profiles vs how they are described, I am thinking that most of the descriptions are just marketing fluff. I've tried a few different ways to view the actual contact area of the stylus to see if I can verify so-called "elliptical", "line contact", etc but it's tough, and so far I don't see much correlation. Some ellipticals look more like line contacts, and vice versa. So-called hyper-ellipticals are really tough to view contact areas on. I don't own any Micro Ridge or SAS types, though I do plan on upgrading at least one stylus to SAS/S or even SAS/R at some point to see if it's worth the cost vs other shapes. I am for sure hearing the differences, though I think much of the differences are simply due to break-in after so many years of neglect. I suppose I will need to break-in a bunch of cartridges before I can really make an assessment...
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby ray_parkhurst » 25 Jan 2017 05:17

I purchased a N110HE NEO SAS/S and am starting to listen to it. Quite a different presentation than the original N110HE. Both styli present essentially "perfect" playback, ie I don't hear any issues (mistracking, noticeable distortion, sibilance, excessive groove noise, etc). I need to spend more time with some reference disks to evaluate soundstage, harmonic presentations, etc, so it will be some time til I can pass any judgement. For now, I can say that the JICO stylus is simply superb, with phenomenal build quality. Here is a top-down shot showing the contact area, and an overall shot showing the stylus and end of the sapphire cantilever...

http://i943.photobucket.com/albums/ad273/rparkhurst/N110he%20neosass_f1.jpg

http://i943.photobucket.com/albums/ad273/rparkhurst/N110he%20neosass_f.jpg
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby jdjohn » 25 Jan 2017 05:47

Audio Technica ATN12S stylus with Shibata tip. This is a bonded tip. The ATS12S has a nude-mounted Shibata.
AT12Sa front2.jpg

AT12Sa back.jpg

Different lighting from the back.
AT12Sa back2.jpg

You can see the scalloped facets in the back.
AT12Sa bottom.jpg
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby lini » 25 Jan 2017 14:47

jdj: Just for the record, the ATS12S exists in both variations - so one will have to check with the vendor, whether an offered exemplar is nude or bonded...

Greetings from Munich!

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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby totem » 25 Jan 2017 21:12

Very nice photography guy's, nice to see that pic of the new NEO SAS/S.
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby flavio81 » 19 Jul 2017 00:28

Just came here to say "i'm not dead!"

Really NICE pictures you guys are uploading here!!

Melos Antropon wrote:A masterful presentation, Flavio! Bravo!

Tony


Thanks Tony. I think next project should be a similar thread but dedicated to the all-important, often-ignored, cantilever!
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby lini » 19 Jul 2017 13:12

Nice to see you alive (and hopefully also still kickin'... ;)), Flavio.

And yup, a bit on cantilevers surely wouldn't harm - possibly also including different styles of how exactly the diamonds are mounted (i.e. pierced cantilever & shank glued from the back side vs. non-pierced cantilever & shank glued to bevelled surface or front).

Greetings from Munich!

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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby BeeKay79 » 18 Oct 2017 09:24

Hello everyone.

My first post here, but I was lurking in the "dark" for some time.
IMHO, this is one of the most interesting and giving forums/discussions.

I want to talk about e.g. MicroLine stylus a bit.
The smaller radius is about 0,12mil or 3 microns. Isn´t the radius small enough to pick up the noise from vinyls? In the picture under, you can see those tiny ribbon like lines about 0,12mil or 3 microns "thick" perpendicular to the groove of a DMM (direct metal mastering) master disc created by the cutting lathe itself. If stylus runs over these grooves it may create unwanted vibrations. Or am I wrong?

Anyone on this?

Cheers :D
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby riccardo » 18 Oct 2017 10:14

following this great thread
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby billshurv » 18 Oct 2017 10:41

not high enough res photo to understand what you mean, sorry.
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby BeeKay79 » 18 Oct 2017 14:04

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the resolution of the picture. Just click on it, zoom in and have a look on the groove number 5 from left, at approximately 50 microns on the scale. Now you see those tiny hairlines inside the groove?
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby BMRR » 18 Oct 2017 14:58

As an owner of several MicroLine styli, I can tell you that they are a bit more sensitive to surface noise than the other shapes; however, I do not find this objectionable at all. It's a very small price to pay for the stylus' ability to pick up musical details that other styli cannot pick up, as well as its ability to read past severe groove damage that would render certain records unlistenable with other stylus shapes.

I have a few classical records that were made using the DMM process and they sound absolutely spectacular with my MicroLine styli. :D

The photo is very interesting. Thank you for sharing it. :)
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby chiz » 18 Oct 2017 15:06

BeeKay79 wrote:My first post here

Hello and welcome :)
Nice photo, thanks for sharing.
BeeKay79 wrote:If stylus runs over these grooves it may create unwanted vibrations. Or am I wrong?

Looks like high frequency information to me, not noise.
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Re: Advanced Stylus Shapes: Pics, discussion, patents.

Postby spunkerboybr » 18 Oct 2017 15:10

The point BeeKay79 and BMRR raised does make sense. Although I have no experience with DMM records, what I could notice from my collection is that most 1960s-1970s EMI-Odeon Brazilian pressings usually show some surface noise with my AT440MLa that is not present at all with the AT120E. This doesn't happen with other pressings.
EMI-Odeon Brazilian pressings are among the best local pressings we have here. They were consistently made in very thick vinyl throughout all the years and exhibit nice polishing and finish. Due to the fact that they are very thick, I wonder if the deepest areas of the groove are subject to imperfections that are not detected by blunter styli, but which are traced by the MicroLine stylus on the AT440MLa.
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