JAZZ cartridge

the thin end of the wedge
pedro ebro
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JAZZ cartridge

Post by pedro ebro » 25 Jan 2020 09:40

I need help choosing MM, MC cartridge with at least 0.5mv output or high output to listen to my JAZZ LP collection of the original 60 70 80, my 16g effective mass tonarm, my MM 36db MC phono amplifier 56db maximum price 450euros
thanks for your thoughts and opinions
This is a translation from GOOGLE ,,,

nat
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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by nat » 25 Jan 2020 14:59

More information about your tonearm would be helpful. And the rest of your system. Often jazz can sound very good on relatively unpretentious cartridges, so don't assume you have to spend your whole budget. This is especially the case if you are going to have to buy the cartridge unheard. It's a lot less painful to buy a cartridge that isn't everything you hoped if you haven't spent a ton of money on it.
It would also be helpful if you gave us some idea of what cartridges you have heard and liked. Cartridges are very taste dependent.

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by pedro ebro » 25 Jan 2020 15:56

Q acoustic 3050, single unison research amplifier, marantz network audio, cd Nad, turntable fisher mt 6225, under repair, currently a technical audio lp5x with VM95ml, I have had p3 rega, and pro ject 5.1 with 9cc tonearm that impressed me much, better than the Rega, cartridges I have had and sold denon dl160 very good 103 very good, orthophon blue and bronze very analytical but without passion very cold, shure v15 III very good and 91 that is good, typical shure sound, orthoon live red very bad, goldring 1000 series, I did not like them are squeaky, sumiko pearl I liked it very hot and analog, at f7 I also liked it, the ones I liked most for jazz denon dl103, sumiko pearl and shure v15 III, I am looking for something similar to that sound, with refined sound and a little hot

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by patient_ot » 25 Jan 2020 17:06

What is the capacitance of this phono preamp?

Re: jazz, I listen to a lot of it and have many old pressings and newer (often audiophile label) reissues.

IMHO buying a cart for a particular genre of music is misguided if you listen to multiple genres of music, like I do. A cart with a neutral FR and excellent tracking and tracing will sound good with everything. So it doesn't matter if I'm listening to Bill Evans or Hyperdontia - I use the same cartridge for all genres.

The only time I would use a different cartridge would be for a record in rougher shape - in that case I'd grab a cheap conical.

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by johnnywalker » 25 Jan 2020 17:24

The only time I would use a different cartridge would be for a record in rougher shape - in that case I'd grab a cheap conical.
Or maybe for an RCA Dynagroove, on which a conical (perhaps the DL-103) sounds better.

pedro ebro
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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by pedro ebro » 25 Jan 2020 17:47

my lps are only jazz, just jazz, the rest of classical music I prefer CD or network music ,,, I will specify ,, each phono cartridge has a sound profile, a signature, when I listen to my jazz lps I want imagine that I am in a jazz club, dark with tobacco smoke and people around me listening to coltrane, Miles, Oscar Peter, Bill Evans, Art Tatum, Ben Webster, next to me a pretty woman smiling and alcohol, I want warmth, sweat and a little humanity, I want an ANALOG sound, I want that sound,
Come on guys, use the imagination,
100pf capacitance

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by BMRR » 25 Jan 2020 17:56

Denon DL-103 is perfect for the "warm steamy jazz club" experience. :)

If you like the Sumiko Pearl but want to try something different, you could try the new Sumiko Olympia or Sumiko Moonstone.

pedro ebro
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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by pedro ebro » 25 Jan 2020 18:49

Go an American citizen who understands me, thank you,BMRR , this may be the way,,,DENON DL 103 , sumiko moonstone

BMRR
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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by BMRR » 25 Jan 2020 19:05

The DL-103 is very special. I think of it as a romantic cartridge. Sensual. Smooth and liquid, with no friction.

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by 2002afan » 26 Jan 2020 00:45

pedro ebro wrote:
25 Jan 2020 17:47
my lps are only jazz, just jazz, the rest of classical music I prefer CD or network music ,,, I will specify ,, each phono cartridge has a sound profile, a signature, when I listen to my jazz lps I want imagine that I am in a jazz club, dark with tobacco smoke and people around me listening to coltrane, Miles, Oscar Peter, Bill Evans, Art Tatum, Ben Webster, next to me a pretty woman smiling and alcohol, I want warmth, sweat and a little humanity, I want an ANALOG sound, I want that sound,
Come on guys, use the imagination,
100pf capacitance
Pedro, I love your imagination. :) I'm an avid jazz person too. 8) My wish would be able to travel back in time and see them live. [-o<
DENON carts do well with jazz (and all other music) and the 103 will sound sweet when properly set up. I have other DENONs that best the 103R but they were discontinued years ago. They all sound best on my setup at 100pf. :D
An AT VM540ML MM cartridge may also work. Output only 4.0 mV though. Happy hunting and I hope you get a cart that you can enjoy listening to those jazz greats.
Cheers,
WillO

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by mamakasou » 26 Jan 2020 08:43

Another route for you, would be a vintage, high-output cartridge with a conical tip.

Some that come to mind are the Pickering 380 and the Shure SC35C.

Both are smooth and play well for Jazz.

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by raphaelmabo » 26 Jan 2020 09:01

Osawa OS-301 could be the thing. Warmish sound yes but a little "hotter" than Sumiko Pearl. I've had the Sumiko Pearl, love it all the way to the stylus worn out, but yes it can feel a bit too rolled off in the treble.

The new Sumiko's are more dynamic and rhythmic than the Pearl - Both Olympia and Moonstone (thank's to lower mass).

You could also try the LP Gear The Vessel R3SV. The Vessels are closely related to Pearl (same OEM maker, Excel Sound Corp.) but tuned by the LP Gear strongman himself. His vision was to feel and hear the soul in the music, so he rejected the prototypes that didn't touched his heart. Now, The Vessel's starts with the A3SE but this one is too close to the Sumiko so I won't recommend it. The A3SV later up, here it starts becoming really good but I recommend to go for the R3SV instead at a bit higher price because the R3SV responds better to dynamic shifts and the groove, because of the Ruby cantilever. So it's "hotter" (more rhythmic and engaging) than the cheaper versions, without forgetting the heart.

Also the LP Gear BIN 215 and 323 HOMC cartridges. They are new versions of the classic Excel MC100, that also had an incarnation as the Benz MC20E. Now, the BIN 215 is not a cartridge for large scale and complex orchestral works or pumping rock or techno-trance dance music. It will loose itself. But with jazz, soul and acoustic based smaller scale rock and folkmusic and singer/songwriter, it excels. Very musical. However, maybe a bit laidback.

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by pedro ebro » 26 Jan 2020 11:50

Pickering 380 Guuaau too many years and I have discovered that discontinued cartridges it is difficult to find a dignified needle and designed specifically for that cartridge, I owned two wonderful v15 III shures, which seemed to work well with 16g arms although it is said that they need arms light, after tests with lp discs of tests revealed to me that the JICO needle and AVG are not 30cu if not approximately 24,
I prefer cartridges in current production, although as we all know these modern ones are actually designed between 70 and 80, they have only changed the packaging, modern needles and some electrical detail, the Shure 35c is a truck that treads with 4 grams, which already I know, I prefer the shure v15 III and crush it with 16g of arm tone,
we have sumiko moonstone, Vessel R3sv, a relative of sumiko but with less separation of channels, Denon dl 103, LP gear bin 215 and 323 that I don't know, I'm going to investigate a little

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by pedro ebro » 26 Jan 2020 11:56

friend raphaelmabo I've always been curious about Benz micro silver, it's warm or neutral

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Re: JAZZ cartridge

Post by raphaelmabo » 26 Jan 2020 12:28

pedro ebro wrote:
26 Jan 2020 11:56
friend raphaelmabo I've always been curious about Benz micro silver, it's warm or neutral
It has a tight and smooth sound, but I wouldn't call it warm. It's more lean than fat sounding. And it needs good recordings, it excels with them. Good records sounds great, records with poor sound quality or ones that are worn, sounds poor. The Benz really shows up differences in recording quality, mastering and record shape. When it's good, it's great. When it's poor, it's really bad. I do prefer my Benz over the Denon DL-110 that I had before it, the Benz having a more well balanced sound. I found the Denon having a shy midband. Benz has a smooth, easy-going and rhythmic character, it's neither laidback nor forward sounding, so in-the-middle here. A good balance.

I don't have so many jazz records. I have Miles Davis "Amandla" which is one of my all-time favourites and the Bens likes this album. :) Sounds good.

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