Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

the thin end of the wedge
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Sunwire
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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by Sunwire » 11 Jun 2019 00:10

johnnywalker wrote:
09 Jun 2019 00:26


You might be right, but I have it mounted on a 15 gram headshell, and on my SL-1200 I play it with the 10 gram auxilliary weight, which turns my 12-gram effective mass tonearm into something much heavier. Similarly, I play my DL-103 and DL-103R carts on 12-gram headshells with the auxilliary weight, with great results.
Adding the auxiliary weight to the arm may not increase the effective mass. It might even decrease it.
If it's possible to balance the cartridge without using the auxiliary weight, this may give the greater effective mass to the arm because the counterweight will be much farther from the tonearm pivot.

johnnywalker
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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by johnnywalker » 11 Jun 2019 12:26

That's my understanding, too, but with the 15-gram headshell, it is not possible to balance the tonearm without the auxilliary weight.

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by Boltman92124 » 11 Jun 2019 15:23

cafe latte wrote:
08 Jun 2019 23:59
johnnywalker wrote:
08 Jun 2019 12:22
I have received my AT3600l, mounted and aligned it, and listened to it, and I must respectfully disagree. While it is very competent, I do not find it superior to the AT-VM95C. It is better at suppressing surface noise, but its sound quality is, to my ear, not as good. The VM has better high frequency response, and better detail. "Different strokes for different folks," as Sly said.
This has to be a compliance issue IMO. Dad got a AT3600l on my recommendation, which I listened to in the UK on my visit, it did not sound that good. He also bought an elliptical carbon from LP gear and that did improve it on his set up. On my Lenco which quite a heavy arm the at3600l sounds amazing tracking at 2.5g-3g way better than the AT95vmc on any of my turntables. The at3600l sounds good on my Technics but it sound better with the elliptical on that turntable, I have concluded that this must be a compliance thig I am hearing, the AT95vmc is a better compliance match for medium compliance arms, but all things right the at3600l sounds better IMO.
Chris
Right! The LP Gear version sounds great. Lots of air and detail for such a low cost. Plus it sounds "right". I find the AT95 series to sound vague and kind of boring in comparison with any of the stylus' I have for it. The CF3600le competes with my AT120e honestly.

kuja
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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by kuja » 11 Jun 2019 18:10

An AT440MLb is my cartridge of choice for old and worn out records.

Microline stylus digs out information from damaged grooves with as little distortion as possible.
It seems to be able to magically "find" undamaged parts of the grooves that many other styli miss.
I don't like the AT440's sound for regular listening, but I have many old LP's that are unlistenable with my preferred cartridges, that play just fine wth the 440.

Also, AT's lifted top end suits very well old LP's with worn out grooves with diminished high frequencies. On normal records it can sound irritating, but it can bring back life into otherwise dull sounding LPs.
Last edited by kuja on 11 Jun 2019 18:20, edited 2 times in total.

billshurv
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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by billshurv » 11 Jun 2019 19:56

Which brings back to one of the points I made. I tried and failed to do a meta-analysis of views on damaged/noisy records and discovered that, for every one who liked MR/ML profiles someone else found them more noisy than their preferred shape. There is some interesting data in there to be discovered, but the mining is hard work.

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by johnnywalker » 11 Jun 2019 20:30

Also, we are dealing with a very subjective issue here. I have several ML styli, but I personally do not prefer them for beater records because the surface noise they do recognize and reproduce is irritating to me, and intrudes into my enjoyment of the underlying music. Someone else may hardly hear the same level of surface noise. So "one man's trash is another man's treasure," I guess.

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by billshurv » 11 Jun 2019 21:11

Yes it is subjective. But I haven't seen any attempts to quantify it. Maybe another thing to add to my list when I finally get a round tuit. Some of it may be down to FR anomalies that some people have with AT carts and others don't?

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by cafe latte » 12 Jun 2019 00:02

I just put on whatever cart I am in the mood for, not one for beater records, sometimes I just enjoy a bog standard AT3600l for what it is and smile at how good it is sounding and how crazy it is to fit a 20 dollar cart to my system just pure fun listening.
Chris

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by AudioFeline » 12 Jun 2019 05:29

johnnywalker wrote:
11 Jun 2019 20:30
Also, we are dealing with a very subjective issue here...
Yes, there is a degree of subjectivity here. But it also depends on hardware comparability - the matching of the cart to the arm/headshell and the rest of the system.

AsOriginallyRecorded
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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by AsOriginallyRecorded » 12 Jun 2019 07:10

It is rare for me to buy anything I would call a "beater" record to be honest. Some of the album jackets are occasionally rougher than I would usually consider, but sometimes the record itself can be in quite good condition. Cleanliness is important to me as well, and won't often waste much time or effort (to say nothing of considerable disappointment) in trying to redeem records that have gone past the point of reasonable value. With these caveats in mind, I rely on either an AT95e, or an AT3400 with AT95e stylus to test play my first play "status unknown" records. Both are very durable, and on the better records, will give me a better feel for the integrity of the music on the record and approximate what I will hear with better cartridges. With several TTs in play, there is no absolute need for switching cartridges....I switch TTs! 8) :lol:

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by Pure_brew » 12 Jun 2019 12:38

The Shure m35x stylus at 3 grams for "beaters" would be the most disposable for me - On a SC35C or M97xe cartridge, there are a decent amount of options to choose from for swapping.

But these are going away and the price is going up.

In my opinion, the SC35C needs a beefy tonearm to sound any good, so I think in reality, the turntable/arm should be considered.

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by billshurv » 12 Jun 2019 21:12

Pure_brew wrote:
12 Jun 2019 12:38

In my opinion, the SC35C needs a beefy tonearm to sound any good, so I think in reality, the turntable/arm should be considered.
Can't argue that the SC35C needs a heavy tonearm to cope with its loooow compliance, but not sure that the table or arm matters too much from the point of view of beaters.

As I have said before, I play all records on my best stylus first. If there are issues it gets put aside on the 'experiment' pile to try on others. I would like to try and get some correlation one day but that will be a while away.

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by mamakasou » 12 Jun 2019 23:02

Some choices for noisy records that come to mind (in order of preference):

Stanton Trackmaster II SK
Pickering NP/AC
Stanton 500EL
Stanton 500AL mkII
Shure M92E
ADC QLM30 mkIII
Shure M44C
Audio Technica VM95C or AT91
Shure SC35C

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by billshurv » 12 Jun 2019 23:24

But why? And any evidence those are better. Serious question as the only data point I have is from ThomasA who posted same track on ortofon OM10/20/40 where the 40 did seem noisier.

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Re: Favorite cartridge for "beater" records?

Post by cafe latte » 13 Jun 2019 09:25

mamakasou wrote:
12 Jun 2019 23:02
Some choices for noisy records that come to mind (in order of preference):

Stanton Trackmaster II SK
Pickering NP/AC
Stanton 500EL
Stanton 500AL mkII
Shure M92E
ADC QLM30 mkIII
Shure M44C
Audio Technica VM95C or AT91
Shure SC35C
The trackmaster II with a snipped down Shibata or vivid line for a Stanton 881 sounds amazing actually rivalling some very serious carts.
Chris

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