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Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

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Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby bbus » 20 Oct 2014 22:29

Hello, just picked up a Dual 1215S. It is in beautiful original condition. I have a lot of experience with restoring tube era equipment and changers but this is my first Dual-more modern unit.

Changer still has what appears to be the original Shure M91E on it. It works excellent after I cleaned up the connections and pins. One thing that I was curious about was proper placement of the cart in the head shell. I have heard that Dual made a small plastic adapter to fit over the head shell to line up the cart and needle. Is this a MUST or can I use some other method. I downloaded an alignment protractor but not sure how this helps with proper cart placement front to back.

Thanks
T
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby BrianMcAllister » 21 Oct 2014 01:24

Todd,

I can find no info on 1015S, only 1015 and 1015F. It occurs to me that the S may signify that it was actually supplied with a Shure cartridge from the factory, rather than without cartridge as most Dual TTs were. In that case no adjustment is usually required, or even possible. If the cartridge carrier is the standard TK12, then the easiest way to adjust the cartridge position is with the plastic gauge.

Here is a link to a sold listing for a couple to give you an idea what they sell for. There is also a new aftermarket replica that goes for $30.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dual-TK-12-Head ... 7675.l2557

I see no current listings for any.

If you find that you need one, contact me on ARF, where we both hang out.

Brian
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby JoeE SP9 » 21 Oct 2014 02:42

Using an alignment protractor assures proper cartridge alignment in every way. It assures proper overhang and tangency at the null points.
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby bbus » 21 Oct 2014 07:03

BrianMcAllister wrote:Todd,

I can find no info on 1015S, only 1015 and 1015F. It occurs to me that the S may signify that it was actually supplied with a Shure cartridge from the factory, rather than without cartridge as most Dual TTs were. In that case no adjustment is usually required, or even possible. If the cartridge carrier is the standard TK12, then the easiest way to adjust the cartridge position is with the plastic gauge.

Here is a link to a sold listing for a couple to give you an idea what they sell for. There is also a new aftermarket replica that goes for $30.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dual-TK-12-Head ... 7675.l2557

I see no current listings for any.

If you find that you need one, contact me on ARF, where we both hang out.

Brian


Brian, seems you mis-read my post. I have a 1215-S not a 1015-S. From what I have read the 10## and 12## series are completely different units. The 10 being the early versions. Mine is a 1215S and pretty common. I have found out there is a 1215 and a 1215S. The S designates the higher end tone arm found on better models and the plain 1215 has the cheaper all plastic one piece tone arm.

I also found out there is a TK12 and TK14 head shell. The TK12 is for the 1000 series tables and the TK14 is for the 1200 Series. So seems I have the TK14 head shell. There is supposedly a small plastic tool used to properly align the cart in the head shell. I see them online but for more then I paid for the entire turntable, plinth and dust cover...all still in their original boxes.

I did download one of the protractors from the web site here but found that I can slide the cart front to back and it still fits the protractor lines. Seems that protractor is more to properly square the cart in the head shell. I was looking to find where Dual recommends the cart sits front to back and then I would do the protractor and make sure it is squared as well. Seems all Duals came with this small jig but seems most have been tossed or lost.

T
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby BrianMcAllister » 21 Oct 2014 20:26

You are right, I did misread your post - several times! Must be old age getting to me.
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby dual-1229q » 23 Feb 2016 00:21

dual 721 & 1229q cartridge set up alignment using protractor
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby kenny123 » 23 Feb 2016 05:04

I'd like to have the jig also but don't want to pay 25 bucks for the aftermarket tk14 jig,you can download a protractor from here for free that gives proper alighnment for free or buy a cheap mirrored one like I did.
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby noisefreq » 23 Feb 2016 09:54

I struggled with this same problem when I bought my first Dual. The plastic overhang gauge is really the easiest way to set up the cartridge in the TK14/TK24 headshell. Unfortunately, there really isn't a specific protractor for these Dual arms. I've played with the the "stupid protractor" here on VE and got pretty close. It's just a pain removing the headshell every time you want to make an adjustment. Bite the bullet and look for an alignment gauge. Check for Dual and PE headshells. You might get lucky and find a cheap one.
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby Tinkaroo » 23 Feb 2016 13:04

I like the Dual alignment jig too, since it is quick and easy, plus I have a few Dual's.

There must have been millions of these supplied with Dual turntables, but probably a lot of people didn't know what they are for so discarded them or threw them into a junk drawer.
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby carcajoudip » 12 Aug 2017 01:22

Bonjour,
I just got my father's Dual 1215 (no antiskating) out of the mothballs.....he bought it in 1971 and 46 years later it got working well after a good de-oxit of all the electrical and signal contacts. I am impress how this piece of German engineering still works after all these years. Even the idler pulley is still fairly soft and flexible. And the Shure Tracking force gauge confirmed the VTF dial on the dual is very precise.

With the original Shure M55e on it - that I assumed was aligned with the Shure plastic protractor 46 years ago....a lot of distortion could be heard during playback the last 3rd of the records.

I then printed from this site the Heybrook dual null point protractor (that printed with only .1mm error on my printer) and I aligned the M55e with this. I had to skew the cartrige in the headshell to get the proper alignment on both null points but it work and playing records sounded better and very reasonable. One of the null point is very close to the last grooves of the records.

I then installed and old Ortofon 540Mk II cartridge on the Dual 1215 and I also aligned it with the Heybrook protractor. It worked fine. I play records with 3 other vinyls under the one playing to get the Stylus roughly at 92 degre angle.

I have used this set up to digitalized (in 24 bit / 96Khz) my father's very old records that bear the scars of many years careless manipulation - there are so many scratches I did not want to play these records on my main turntable and cartridge. Now I can listen to these records digitally with all the clics and pops in Hi-Res !!!

If someone has tried another 2 null points protractor with good results on a Dual 1215 - I would like to know

Regards

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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby Legrace » 12 Aug 2017 12:25

I dont have a overhang thingy for my Dual. What I do have though is a Mofi universal protractor based on Baerwald geometry.

First time using it I couldn't quite reach the cross hairs, ran out of slot travel. But it was very close. So I dug around in my parts drawer and found another set of screws with smaller diameter heads. This moved the cartridge another hair forward which was just enough. Without an extra thou of an inch to spare I might add, typical German precision. :lol: Table sounds excellent start to back with no detectable distortion. Normally a LOMC guy but the V15III I'm finding is a wonderfully musical cartridge.

Out of curiosity, anyone else also having their cartridge screws jammed up tight against the front of the slots in the carrier?
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby Tinkaroo » 12 Aug 2017 14:55

Legrace wrote:I dont have a overhang thingy for my Dual. What I do have though is a Mofi universal protractor based on Baerwald geometry.

First time using it I couldn't quite reach the cross hairs, ran out of slot travel. But it was very close. So I dug around in my parts drawer and found another set of screws with smaller diameter heads. This moved the cartridge another hair forward which was just enough. Without an extra thou of an inch to spare I might add, typical German precision. :lol: Table sounds excellent start to back with no detectable distortion. Normally a LOMC guy but the V15III I'm finding is a wonderfully musical cartridge.

Out of curiosity, anyone else also having their cartridge screws jammed up tight against the front of the slots in the carrier?


I use the Dual alignment thingy and with the V15 type III the screws are right up to the end of the slots,likewise with the M95ED but with the M91ED you are located about mid point. So it depends on the cartridge.
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby carcajoudip » 12 Aug 2017 19:06

Legrace & Tinkaro

Thank you for replying to my question. I would like to reproduce the alignment you used but I do not own the Dual Plastic protractor nor the Mofi protractor. If you have a chance - can you provide a very precise measurement of the distance between the stylus and the back (straight edge)of the cartdridge holder (removed from the arm)? I could align the Ortofon stylus to the same distance and reproduce your alignement and listen to it.

On the tread link below - there is a picture that suggests that 1 inch and 1/8 is the distance between the back of the cartridge holder straight edge to the stylus.
viewtopic.php?f=37&t=75266

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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby Legrace » 13 Aug 2017 01:43

1.125" makes sense, I measure 30 mm by eye give or take.
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Re: Dual 1215S cartridge set up alignment

Postby Tinkaroo » 13 Aug 2017 10:06

carcajoudip wrote:Legrace & Tinkaro

Thank you for replying to my question. I would like to reproduce the alignment you used but I do not own the Dual Plastic protractor nor the Mofi protractor. If you have a chance - can you provide a very precise measurement of the distance between the stylus and the back (straight edge)of the cartdridge holder (removed from the arm)? I could align the Ortofon stylus to the same distance and reproduce your alignement and listen to it.

On the tread link below - there is a picture that suggests that 1 inch and 1/8 is the distance between the back of the cartridge holder straight edge to the stylus.
viewtopic.php?f=37&t=75266

Regards
Carcajou


Yes, that is correct 1-1/8" from the back straight edge or 5/16" from the front. I measured with an accurate steel ruler on a factory mounted Shure V15 Type III cartridge.
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