How much did your TT(s) cost?

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tlscapital
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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by tlscapital » 01 Oct 2019 08:21

vinyl master wrote:
01 Oct 2019 05:25
Just curious, but what idlers did you have again, kashofa? :-k I'm willing to bet that if they are good or at least, halfway decent, you could EASILY recoup your $$$ via Craigslist (or EBay, if you had to...) with them...
Was wondering also... A Garrard 301 :P Anyway, if indeed some idlers are still worth some money even if in need of serious repair, service and/or parts change, they will still require maintenance and a good tweaker "eye" afterward.

Some prefer the easier "mindless" option/resolution and find still enjoyable playback rendition. Which is most fair even if I am of the other kind and favor the older kinds and don't mind tweaking some for optimal playback and look.
vinyl master wrote:
01 Oct 2019 05:25
Personally, if I were you, I wouldn't totally give up on them...Many an idler has been brought back to life due to the info and expertise of the Engineers here on VE, even some that looked like they had seen much better days...
So as you said, some pennies or more are still retrievable from that "dismantled" idler but to put it back in full working order will require anyone some tweaker skills, patience and some funds. Hopefully not too much if ever... If ever only.

To attest that it's not always as simple or cheap; ask how much a pro would charge just to "service" such a turntable ! Then if a recap has to be applied, a rubber replaced or a full dismantling for a deep clean of the old grease muck... !$!

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by Kashofa » 01 Oct 2019 17:23

vinyl master wrote:
01 Oct 2019 05:25
Just curious, but what idlers did you have again, kashofa?
All relatively inexpensive...

Elac Miracord 40A - seems to work reliably but has a wicked wobble in the platter. I have not stripped it down to the bearings to see if that will help.

Garrard 440M - Siezed speed selection as usual when purchased. I tore it down cleaned and lubricated. Speed selection is now extremely smooth. Speed is reliable. Platter wobbles. I did lubricate the bearing when it was apart. It seemed OK when I added lubricant. The wobble is not terrible like the Miracord, but it's obvious. I'm used to 80s DD platters that spin without perceptible wobble and don't like seeing this. It does play 78s and tracks ok despite the wobble. That's with a V15 cartridge and a new 78 stylus.

Purchased a 2nd Garrard 440 because it was cheap and to compare. Platter wobbles identically to my first, and speed selection is siezed. I have not torn it down to fix.

Dual 1019 - At last a platter that spins without wobbling! I was able to clean it up and resolder a loose wire. Speed is not working. Speed selector works fine, but at 78 spins variously anywhere from 70 to 58 rpm. I am preparing to send out the idler for a re-rubbering. If the speed can be made to work I'll start on the tonearm drop points. Currently it misses the start of a 10" record and doesn't quite come back to the stop point and about 3/4 of the time decides to replay the record instead of stopping at the end.

I wouldn't say I've given up on these. They are a bit fun to work on (and cheaper and easier than the Volvo S70 that was my previous mechanical toy). But honestly I like listening to 78s while these projects are not actually functioning. So the AT120 has been a wonderful addition :)

And someone might want to caution new idler buyers exactly what they are getting into ;)

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by cwalter48 » 01 Oct 2019 17:39

I just acquired a brand new GPO PR100 for £62. For the money it works very well. Only downside is the manual is next to useless.

vinyl master
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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by vinyl master » 02 Oct 2019 03:20

Kashofa wrote:
01 Oct 2019 17:23
vinyl master wrote:
01 Oct 2019 05:25
Just curious, but what idlers did you have again, kashofa?
All relatively inexpensive...

Elac Miracord 40A - seems to work reliably but has a wicked wobble in the platter. I have not stripped it down to the bearings to see if that will help.

Garrard 440M - Siezed speed selection as usual when purchased. I tore it down cleaned and lubricated. Speed selection is now extremely smooth. Speed is reliable. Platter wobbles. I did lubricate the bearing when it was apart. It seemed OK when I added lubricant. The wobble is not terrible like the Miracord, but it's obvious. I'm used to 80s DD platters that spin without perceptible wobble and don't like seeing this. It does play 78s and tracks ok despite the wobble. That's with a V15 cartridge and a new 78 stylus.

Purchased a 2nd Garrard 440 because it was cheap and to compare. Platter wobbles identically to my first, and speed selection is siezed. I have not torn it down to fix.

Dual 1019 - At last a platter that spins without wobbling! I was able to clean it up and resolder a loose wire. Speed is not working. Speed selector works fine, but at 78 spins variously anywhere from 70 to 58 rpm. I am preparing to send out the idler for a re-rubbering. If the speed can be made to work I'll start on the tonearm drop points. Currently it misses the start of a 10" record and doesn't quite come back to the stop point and about 3/4 of the time decides to replay the record instead of stopping at the end.

I wouldn't say I've given up on these. They are a bit fun to work on (and cheaper and easier than the Volvo S70 that was my previous mechanical toy). But honestly I like listening to 78s while these projects are not actually functioning. So the AT120 has been a wonderful addition :)

And someone might want to caution new idler buyers exactly what they are getting into ;)
The 40a and the 1019 are great idlers, by the way, kashofa, although I've never had a major wobble issue with mine...I did buy the Elac from an older gentleman who took good care of his for many years and the 1019 came from one of the members here on VE...Of course, as with any TT one buys, it can always use a little more TLC...One thing I wanted to ask...Where is the turntable situated? Is it on a level surface? A good round bubble level can help determine that and is a good tool to have in your arsenal...There were some thoughts here, as well, on the subject of platter wobble...

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/ ... er.393627/

Regarding the speed issue on the 1019, sometimes these things are a matter of trial-and-error to get it working and playing correctly...Check out these threads here, too...

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php ... 19.860425/
https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_f ... hp?t=26897

By any chance, have you lubricated the motor? That's one major area you could focus on, if you haven't...I will also say that if you want to give it another go, you should contact our own Don about the Dual kit he sells, if you haven't already...Don's (member mrow2 here) kit is worth the purchase JUST for the informative PDF file he includes that explains more in detail on refurbishing and restoring these old Duals than I can go into on one post...Of course, he also includes a sample of the right Alvania grease and a proper steuerpimpel or two...You could PM him for more details and the purchase helps him to keep making these kits for all the Dual newbies out there...It might be just what the doctor ordered! :wink:

In any case, maybe something there will help...They're not worth giving up on, at least not yet, and if you ever DID decide to sell them, I'm sure there would be no shortage of takers willing to tackle those projects...

You could also start a separate post or two about them here on VE, if you haven't yet and maybe get a few more responses...They are excellent turntables that just need a little time, love and patience... =D>

KMN
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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by KMN » 04 Oct 2019 11:22

Pioneer PL 12 AC . . . .£70
then "accidently" won a PL12D for £75 on Ebay.
Now gone vinyl daft and as I have spare cartridges, must look for another turntable.
Is there such a thing as TTA ?
(Turntablers anonymous)
Last edited by KMN on 04 Oct 2019 11:24, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by KMN » 04 Oct 2019 11:24

Do I need help or should I give in to the collector bug?

rachelcm
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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by rachelcm » 06 Oct 2019 18:26

Well I'm new to the forum and hardly an audiophile. I bought my partner a turntable after a year or so of talking of getting one. It was a cheap, plastic-fanastic usb SoundLab table with adjustable tracking force and anti skate. It sounded very much better than it's build but the build is awful and I really feel it's about time I upgraded to a proper TT. Compared to the IONS and Crossleys I know this thing looks after vinyl a lot better and to be honest I was totoally amazed by the sound quality, especially after replacing the cart with an at95e I paid just £25 for on amazon.

I've just paid £100 for a good condition Pioneer PL-400 recently and am planning to slowly upgrade it. I live in a flat so am limited to what amps etc I can use as I simply have such little space. I use my PC with a soundblaster audigy soundcard as my media center and run the turntable through a Behringer UFO202 (bought to record a friend's gig onto my laptop many moons ago) for preamp into the USB interface line in. I still have cheap 5.1 analogue logitech PC speakers so I know I'm not anywhere near the sound quality of most here, but you have to start somewhere and those speakers pack a lot more punch than their size belies.

Please don't be overly critical of my setup. It does sound a hell of a lot better than it looks on paper. I may not be an audiophile, I wouldn't dream of imagining it with my current setup, but I know when something sounds bad and feel able to say I'm proud of what I've got using a lot of equipment I already owned. It definitely makes my vinyl more than listenable and to the point where I thing they sound really good. I'll be interested to see how much better it sounds with the new TT, I know it'll take a better pre amp, amp and speakers to really bring out the quality but for the moment it'll have to do :-)

SpyderTracks
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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by SpyderTracks » 06 Oct 2019 18:33

rachelcm wrote:
06 Oct 2019 18:26
Well I'm new to the forum and hardly an audiophile. I bought my partner a turntable after a year or so of talking of getting one. It was a cheap, plastic-fanastic usb SoundLab table with adjustable tracking force and anti skate. It sounded very much better than it's build but the build is awful and I really feel it's about time I upgraded to a proper TT. Compared to the IONS and Crossleys I know this thing looks after vinyl a lot better and to be honest I was totoally amazed by the sound quality, especially after replacing the cart with an at95e I paid just £25 for on amazon.

I've just paid £100 for a good condition Pioneer PL-400 recently and am planning to slowly upgrade it. I live in a flat so am limited to what amps etc I can use as I simply have such little space. I use my PC with a soundblaster audigy soundcard as my media center and run the turntable through a Behringer UFO202 (bought to record a friend's gig onto my laptop many moons ago) for preamp into the USB interface line in. I still have cheap 5.1 analogue logitech PC speakers so I know I'm not anywhere near the sound quality of most here, but you have to start somewhere and those speakers pack a lot more punch than their size belies.

Please don't be overly critical of my setup. It does sound a hell of a lot better than it looks on paper. I may not be an audiophile, I wouldn't dream of imagining it with my current setup, but I know when something sounds bad and feel able to say I'm proud of what I've got using a lot of equipment I already owned. It definitely makes my vinyl more than listenable and to the point where I thing they sound really good. I'll be interested to see how much better it sounds with the new TT, I know it'll take a better pre amp, amp and speakers to really bring out the quality but for the moment it'll have to do :-)
That's better than the setup I started with! I started with a 2.1 speaker setup on my computer, no soundcard, no hifi equipment whatsoever (that was only about 9 years ago) and have gravitated over the years to a much higher configuration on vinyl. Like you I'm pushed for space, but am looking to move to a larger place in a few years so currently upgrading my digital speaker to an amp and floorstanders in preparation.

It's about the journey, and thoroughly enjoying every stage and appreciating the incremental improvements we can make over time as our tastes and musical sensitivity matures. I don't think anyone on any audio centric forum would judge you for your current setup! It just means you've got so much goodness to follow :)

Just to add, it was getting my first proper turntable that made me start to invest so heavily in audio. I'd had CD and digital previously, but never felt the sheer joy and specialness that I do in collecting vinyl and the better sound. Since experiencing the difference between digital and vinyl, it set something loose in me, and now I collect records quite obsessively and invest in equipment in a way I never thought I'd be able to, let alone have the passion for. It's been thoroughly enjoyable, learning all the different hardware types, the different pressing plants, the good and bad remasters, originals and represses.... I'm truly hooked! =D>

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by rachelcm » 06 Oct 2019 19:59

SpyderTracks wrote:
06 Oct 2019 18:33
That's better than the setup I started with! I started with a 2.1 speaker setup on my computer, no soundcard, no hifi equipment whatsoever (that was only about 9 years ago) and have gravitated over the years to a much higher configuration on vinyl. Like you I'm pushed for space, but am looking to move to a larger place in a few years so currently upgrading my digital speaker to an amp and floorstanders in preparation.

It's about the journey, and thoroughly enjoying every stage and appreciating the incremental improvements we can make over time as our tastes and musical sensitivity matures. I don't think anyone on any audio centric forum would judge you for your current setup! It just means you've got so much goodness to follow :)

Just to add, it was getting my first proper turntable that made me start to invest so heavily in audio. I'd had CD and digital previously, but never felt the sheer joy and specialness that I do in collecting vinyl and the better sound. Since experiencing the difference between digital and vinyl, it set something loose in me, and now I collect records quite obsessively and invest in equipment in a way I never thought I'd be able to, let alone have the passion for. It's been thoroughly enjoyable, learning all the different hardware types, the different pressing plants, the good and bad remasters, originals and represses.... I'm truly hooked! =D>
That sounds very much like me now. It was actually my partner who started all this, going on about vinyl and me being the digital philistine insisting that all vinyl sounded like scratchy, tinny, popping rubbish (well my old suitcase TT I had as a kid sounded just like that!) Eventually I bought a TT for a xmas present and the rest is very much history. I've eaten way more humble pie than I care to remember but the crazy thing is that all this has awoken my inner geek. It's me wanting better, it was me who upgraded our old cart, it's me who pushed for the upgrade to the PL-400, or rather I bought my own now as I have nearly as much vinyl. I am the one who built our media center, Ill be the one who does all the techie stuff with the TT, i just enjoy getting the most out of what I have.

We've probably spent close to £3000 on vinyl in the past 3 years, and i can guarantee half of it is on me. I just love it, I never fully went digital in terms of MP3 downloads or even FLAC, yes I use these formats for convenience but I never buy digital downloads, just rip my cds or vinyl. I've pretty much stopped buying CDs too now. It's the sound, the physical process and holding that superb artwork that looks so much better in a gatefold sleeve than a crappy CD booklet or thumbnail on a screen will ever look. I'm glad I grew up when I did to be longing for the way we used to buy music, the digital revolution has stalled and it simply can't replicate analogue perfection. no matter how detailed it gets. I feel it lacks soul, and there's something intangibly superior to listening to music on vinyl, even on my most basic of setups :D

Oh the criticism happened on a facebook group a couple years ago. Someone insisting because we didn't have a proper turntable that cost at least £300, ours was crap. How we couldn't possibly think it sounded better than a CD through our setup. I'd have invited the guy round to check if he wasn't so full of his own ... well lets say I don't post anything there that he can jump on anymore :!:
Last edited by rachelcm on 06 Oct 2019 20:20, edited 1 time in total.

SpyderTracks
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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by SpyderTracks » 06 Oct 2019 20:13

rachelcm wrote:
06 Oct 2019 19:59
We've probably spent close to £3000 on vinyl in the past 3 years, and i can guarantee half of it is on me. I just love it, I never fully went digital in terms of MP3 downloads or even FLAC, yes I use these formats for convenience but I never buy digital downloads, just rip my cds or vinyl. I've pretty much stopped buying CDs too now. It's the sound, the physical process and holding that superb artwork that looks so much better in a gatefold sleeve than a crappy CD booklet or thumbnail on a screen will ever look. I'm glad I grew up when I did to be longing for the way we used to buy music, the digital revolution has stalled and it simply can't replicate analogue perfection. no matter how detailed it gets. I feel it lacks soul, and there's something intangibly superior to listening to music on vinyl, even on my most basic of setups :D
God, it's like listening to soundwaves from a mirror! Totally the same for me. It's not just about the music, but the physicality of each album or single, there's a uniqueness to each pressing, each series, each distributor, they all do their covers slightly differently or add little nuances to the artwork.

The sound as well though, I started off aiming for "accurate" sound. My best friend is quite an accomplished audio engineer (working with digital) and comes from a place of "accuracy is most important", and so bought into that. As I've progressed with my system and vinyl, I've found exactly what you mentioned.... that "soul" that really shines through when you hit the sound that works for you. For me, that's on the warmer side of accuracy, so I'm now looking at a tube amp to emphasise that warmth. It's just an onward journey into finding that epic soundwave that hits my bones where I need it! :lol:

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by mfweert » 11 Oct 2019 18:19

My Lenco L 78 was 100 Euro with a Lenco M 100 cartridge wit original manual and a extra new needle. This tt is in mint condition!

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by butterfield » 12 Oct 2019 23:33

I am interested in prices that I paid for me tables so I will dig up the price list this is more a test my first time on this sight

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by Sterling1 » 13 Oct 2019 00:20

rachelcm wrote:
06 Oct 2019 19:59
SpyderTracks wrote:
06 Oct 2019 18:33
That's better than the setup I started with! I started with a 2.1 speaker setup on my computer, no soundcard, no hifi equipment whatsoever (that was only about 9 years ago) and have gravitated over the years to a much higher configuration on vinyl. Like you I'm pushed for space, but am looking to move to a larger place in a few years so currently upgrading my digital speaker to an amp and floorstanders in preparation.

It's about the journey, and thoroughly enjoying every stage and appreciating the incremental improvements we can make over time as our tastes and musical sensitivity matures. I don't think anyone on any audio centric forum would judge you for your current setup! It just means you've got so much goodness to follow :)

Just to add, it was getting my first proper turntable that made me start to invest so heavily in audio. I'd had CD and digital previously, but never felt the sheer joy and specialness that I do in collecting vinyl and the better sound. Since experiencing the difference between digital and vinyl, it set something loose in me, and now I collect records quite obsessively and invest in equipment in a way I never thought I'd be able to, let alone have the passion for. It's been thoroughly enjoyable, learning all the different hardware types, the different pressing plants, the good and bad remasters, originals and represses.... I'm truly hooked! =D>
That sounds very much like me now. It was actually my partner who started all this, going on about vinyl and me being the digital philistine insisting that all vinyl sounded like scratchy, tinny, popping rubbish (well my old suitcase TT I had as a kid sounded just like that!) Eventually I bought a TT for a xmas present and the rest is very much history. I've eaten way more humble pie than I care to remember but the crazy thing is that all this has awoken my inner geek. It's me wanting better, it was me who upgraded our old cart, it's me who pushed for the upgrade to the PL-400, or rather I bought my own now as I have nearly as much vinyl. I am the one who built our media center, Ill be the one who does all the techie stuff with the TT, i just enjoy getting the most out of what I have.

We've probably spent close to £3000 on vinyl in the past 3 years, and i can guarantee half of it is on me. I just love it, I never fully went digital in terms of MP3 downloads or even FLAC, yes I use these formats for convenience but I never buy digital downloads, just rip my cds or vinyl. I've pretty much stopped buying CDs too now. It's the sound, the physical process and holding that superb artwork that looks so much better in a gatefold sleeve than a crappy CD booklet or thumbnail on a screen will ever look. I'm glad I grew up when I did to be longing for the way we used to buy music, the digital revolution has stalled and it simply can't replicate analogue perfection. no matter how detailed it gets. I feel it lacks soul, and there's something intangibly superior to listening to music on vinyl, even on my most basic of setups :D

Oh the criticism happened on a facebook group a couple years ago. Someone insisting because we didn't have a proper turntable that cost at least £300, ours was crap. How we couldn't possibly think it sounded better than a CD through our setup. I'd have invited the guy round to check if he wasn't so full of his own ... well lets say I don't post anything there that he can jump on anymore :!:
Here's a little experiment for you: Get ahold of Barbara Streisand's People LP (1964) and compare it to the Apple Music download of same. The LP is of course pre digital and I believe the digitization of the album was made from tape master. I did this comparison, discovering the Apple Music download to be better in all manner that better can be discerned. The better-ness is particularly acute on the song titled How Does the Wine Taste. The vocals capture Barbara's breath and the bass is deeper to lowest octave. At any rate, this revelation has cause me to reevaluate ripping LPs to my iTunes Library when downloading them takes ZERO time and the downloads typically sound so much better, even at 256k.

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by bryanpaxson » 13 Oct 2019 05:26

I have a Yamaha YP-D6 that I purchased in 1978 connected to a Yamaha CR-1020 that I purchased at the same time. The TT was $250 and the receiver was $500 if I remember correctly. My wife and I assembled about 300 records consisting of most of the popular artists of the late 60s, 70’s and 80’s. She died and I eventually put everything away when I moved. Recently, I got it all back out and connected up to my Sonos system through their new Port device. I replaced the original Realistic/Shure cart with an AT95E for $49. Quite an improvement. Last week, I ran across a JVC QL-A5 TT that was dead for $10. It had a blown fuse and a worn cart. I moved the AT95E to the JVC and bought a Ortofon 2M Blue for $269 for the YP-D6. I am still fine tuning but I think the Ortofon sounds better than the AT. It should considering the price difference. Even though I have been at this hobby for a long time, I’m 75, I am really on a learning curve since most of the information available back when was in magazines or from the local stereo shop where they were more interested in selling you the next upgrade than giving good advice. Even though some of the current forums may contain some folklore and misinformation, no offense intended to anyone here or on audiokarma or anywhere else, for that matter, there are volumes of wisdom available now on the subject of turntables and cartridges that was generally unavailable to someone like me. This, combined with eBay and Amazon makes this hobby much more fun than it was in the old days.

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Re: How much did your TT(s) cost?

Post by Pauw » 13 Oct 2019 09:36

Nice Technics SL D303 acquired for 14 Euros with broken hinges of course. Careful designing making and fitting of new parts to make the hinges work again 10Euros. Clean service and set speed ...good fun and a great project . Fully working now and sounds great just need to buff the cover and I have a great fully auto table.

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