the home of the turntable

BIC turntables?

snap, crackle and pop

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby Doug G. » 19 May 2017 08:35

Norm, I had to laugh at your post because it sounds like me. I have what I call the "do everything twice" theory. It seems I end up doing so many things over because I screw something up or forget to do something the first time.

Some are easy like putting a screw back into the hole after it falls out the first time but others are bad where the thing you forgot is several disassembly steps back to correct it.

I have gotten into some knock-down-drag-outs in other forums about WD-40 with me being a defender of the product. There are some pretty wild claims about it such as it will actually eat away the very metal you use it on or that there is fish oil in it. Or, that it is no way a lubricant at all when it is a petroleum product. Duh.

Anyway, I'm glad you got your 80Z working again.

Doug
Doug G.
long player
long player
 
Posts: 1013
Joined: 02 Dec 2008 02:03
Location: Rochester MN

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby schleif » 20 May 2017 02:57

It looks like the do it twice theoery is going to become a reality. The tonearm is occasionally sticking the 45 position, waiting for the white lithium grease to arrive from Amazon. Also picked up that 80z on ebay for 9.99, hopefully the platter cover is better than mine. Not sure if it supposed to snap on to the platter or just lay on top. It is as if the rubber shrunk a little. Anyway 10 bucks for spare parts seemed like a deal. I bet the fuse is blown in the back and that's why this guy couldn't get it to turn on. It should arrive June 1 and we shall see.
schleif
member
member
 
Posts: 30
Images: 1
Joined: 14 May 2017 02:29

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby Bad Andy » 20 May 2017 03:53

WD-40 is the subject of much discussion in all kinds of forums. Folks get rather religious about it. But look at it this way... There are lots of petrol products that are in no way lubricants or meant to be used as lubricants. And even water can be used as a lubricant in certain scenarios.

You have to consider the primary purpose of a product and how it is supposed to be used in various applications. WD-40 is a light oil with a penetrating solvent carrier. If you have an application that is suited to light oil, then there's nothing intrinsically wrong with WD-40 as long as it and its solvent doesn't attack or dissolve something important. Note that WD-40 is not compatible with some poly- type plastics.

If an engineer decides that a certain type of grease is warranted for an application, you're generally better off sticking with what the engineers recommend, but bearing in mind that even engineering has developed over the decades and what was considered to be good thinking then may not be considered good thinking now, and there are lubricants today that did not exist decades ago.

Also, properly replacing WD-40 with grease later could be tricky unless you first get rid of the WD-40. I believe acetone should be fine for that.
Bad Andy
member
member
 
Posts: 37
Joined: 10 Nov 2015 04:26
Location: NYC

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby Bad Andy » 20 May 2017 07:01

Oh, and I forgot to add that because WD-40 has excellent penetrating solvent properties, if nothing else it will at least have done a fine job of getting rid of whatever caked up, solidified grease and dirt there was gumming things up!
Bad Andy
member
member
 
Posts: 37
Joined: 10 Nov 2015 04:26
Location: NYC

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby schleif » 20 May 2017 14:58

On a separate note, I have been trying to do research on this but came up with nothing. Other than the BIC80z and 85P, where there any other turntables that have a digital speed readout. I have seen a couple of models where the selection of the speed it shown in a digital display (rather than a typed sticker or embossing to the unit) but have not seen any other unit that shows the actual speed in real time digitally displayed and measured.
schleif
member
member
 
Posts: 30
Images: 1
Joined: 14 May 2017 02:29

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby Doug G. » 23 May 2017 09:16

The platter mat on the 80Z has a little lip on the inside rim. It "clips" over a mating lip in the platter itself. In fact, the Z series mats were a reuse of the original mats on the first 900 series before the "segmented" mat, introduced in 1976.

WD-40 was originally formulated to displace moisture. Hence, the "WD". Water Displacement. It also can penetrate corrosion on metals which is why it can be used to free rusted bolts and such. It will lubricate but the lubrication will eventually abate which is why joining surfaces must be lubricated with a longer-lasting lubricant.

BIC did have models in the earlier (by about a year) VIA series which had digital readout. These were the 916MP, 916MPC, 918MP, and 918MPC. I don't know if other manufacturers followed suit but, in those days, it didn't take long before copying of designs were incorporated in competing designs. Industrial espionage was big then.

Doug
Doug G.
long player
long player
 
Posts: 1013
Joined: 02 Dec 2008 02:03
Location: Rochester MN

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby schleif » 23 May 2017 15:51

WOW, the 918mpc looks pretty nice, I have never seen one before. You cant fine a one on the internet. I wonder if they sold many of them. What would be the best grease or lubricant to use if not WD or lithium?
schleif
member
member
 
Posts: 30
Images: 1
Joined: 14 May 2017 02:29

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby schleif » 25 May 2017 00:35

I picked up a BIC 80Z for parts, it was DOA. So if anyone needs parts pulled from an 80z let me know. I have an extra tone arm, platter and most other parts from the unit. All are used of course, but if you need it, it may be in there. What ever it costs to mail it and pack it, you got it. I re greased mine up and it is working great. Nice a 38 year old turntable sounding just as good as it did when I bought it. Thanks everyone for Help and advice, particularly Doug.
schleif
member
member
 
Posts: 30
Images: 1
Joined: 14 May 2017 02:29

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby lreneat » 25 May 2017 04:26

My BIC 980 was a dumpster find some years ago. My first cleaning was enough to know that it was a working unit. I thought later on that the sliding metal plates that control the set down position of the tonearm could be improved with WD-40, but as time moved along, the tonearm set down went back to 7" record mode. The more I consider turntables in general, it is my conclusion that semi-automatic turntables are the best way to go. Too bad that this better conclusion did not come about when Dual turntables entered the 1970's. My only exception to this is the P-Mount cartridge designed turntables. Seems that the 1980's was the point in time when most bothersome problems were removed from turntable older designs. I'm really glad that rim drives are no longer customer options with any new turntables as I have not seen any since the mid-1970's. Belt and direct drive systems are the winners. I have to wonder why turntable manufacturers have not made it normal practice to place belt drive motors at left back side of turntables so that least amount of motor noise can get to cartridge where it is added to cartridge output? I guess they did not in order to save better/best ideas for more expensive turntable models.
lreneat
senior member
senior member
 
Posts: 392
Joined: 19 Oct 2012 04:00

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby Doug G. » 12 Jun 2017 05:12

Sorry I haven't been on here in a while. I have used automotive wheel bearing grease for years for sliding/rotating type surfaces and 20-30 weight motor oil for the platter bearings.

These lubricants have worked very well. I am of the belief that turntable designers/engineers too often overthink and complicate the lubricants to use and this has often lead to problems over time with gumming and hardening.

Of course, silicone damping fluid is used for cuing mechanisms.

Doug
Doug G.
long player
long player
 
Posts: 1013
Joined: 02 Dec 2008 02:03
Location: Rochester MN

United States of America

Re:

Postby Spinner45 » 12 Jun 2017 06:42

pivot wrote:
sktn77a wrote:The 70s models were dead ringers for the BSR units and BIC were in bed with Plessey (Garrard) at that time. Can't say I kept up with their product line into the 80s.


Which 70s BSR models were "dead ringers" for BIC units? Are the BSR units you are thinking of belt drive?

My understanding of BIC history is Garrard tossed them out of bed rather rudely in the 1970s and that is why BIC developed their own turntable line.


You'll hear a lot of "internet chatter" about things.
But basically the BIC brand was a lower-quality branch.
Cute products, but kinda cheap construction,
Spinner45
long player
long player
 
Posts: 1912
Joined: 01 Mar 2017 18:21

United States of America

Re: Re:

Postby Doug G. » 19 Jun 2017 03:40

Spinner45 wrote:You'll hear a lot of "internet chatter" about things.
But basically the BIC brand was a lower-quality branch.
Cute products, but kinda cheap construction,


You are decidedly misinformed, especially referencing the original 900 series. Also, BIC never, ever had any connection to BSR at all.

Doug
Doug G.
long player
long player
 
Posts: 1013
Joined: 02 Dec 2008 02:03
Location: Rochester MN

United States of America

Re: Re:

Postby Spinner45 » 19 Jun 2017 06:02

Doug G. wrote:
Spinner45 wrote:You'll hear a lot of "internet chatter" about things.
But basically the BIC brand was a lower-quality branch.
Cute products, but kinda cheap construction,


You are decidedly misinformed, especially referencing the original 900 series. Also, BIC never, ever had any connection to BSR at all.

Doug


I don't believe I made any reference to BSR as having anything to do with BIC.
However, standing by what I did comment on, after owning a 940, a 960, and having handled a 912, I reasoned that they were cheaply built with problematic flaws in design.
They just didn't have that "nice build quality" such as Dual used to put into their stuff.
In a nutshell, I just didn't like the BIC line.
Spinner45
long player
long player
 
Posts: 1912
Joined: 01 Mar 2017 18:21

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby Devil Dawg » 24 Aug 2017 08:42

Total Newbie to vinyl and this forum. last year my wife bought me a Crosley vintage 3 in 1 since then I've been buying vintage vinyl as I find them in good condition. Needless to say it didn't take an audiophile to figure out that the Crosley was barely any better than the DeeJay Happy Tunes record player with Faux denim print that I have had since I was 5 years old in 1973 (And yes I said have had since I was 5 years old, it sits in a curio cabinet with my collection of vintage cameras) So I've been turntable shopping. Unimpressed with the newer DJ turntables on the market and not having the finances for a high dollar vintage Technics, Marantz, or Thorens I have purchased a recently serviced BIC 940 and mated it to a Panasonic Multiplex receiver. I'm aware this is probably about as primitive as it comes and barely qualifies as a "SYSTEM" but I'm excited to recapture some of the magic I experienced as teenager with my old Soundesign that I thought was the Bomb back then. I plan on saving for a real system but right now I just want a something that will play vinyl "Well". I'm still waiting on Fed Ex but I'll give you the newbies first impressions when it gets here. Thanks for the add looking forward to learning from Y'all.
Devil Dawg
junior member
junior member
 
Posts: 5
Joined: 24 Aug 2017 07:51

United States of America

Re: BIC turntables?

Postby Devil Dawg » 24 Aug 2017 19:42

As an afternote, it dawned on me while reading this thread that I must have truly found the perfect turntable to reflect my personality......
The very idea that a tt could illicit such a response as to warrant someone chiming in about how cheaply built it was built dang near 40 years after its release is reason enough to buy it! Fortunately I paid a whopping $40 including shipping for my 940 so it should be pretty easy to exceed my expectations. But it occurs to me that since we are still having the conversation 40 years later that there is very little evidence supporting the claims,it should be interesting to find out for myself however. Its sort of like when I hear someone say "Harleys are junk!" really.....lets compare a 1917 Harley to a 1917 Honda then. Well you can't! Honda wasn't around in 1917! Exactly! It seems to me that any of the problems related to the tt seem to be a result of the lubricant used rather than the craftsmanship. And as far as I'm aware there are very few lubricants that last 40 years anyhow. If nothing else this tt should at least afford me a inexpensive introduction to "Turntable maintenance and repair" which would be invaluable in itself! Heck I wouldn't want to cut my teeth on a $500-1000 Marantz or Technics! So if nothing else this turntable definitely has a purpose with in the hobby. Thanks guys now I'm even more excited to get my new purchase!
Devil Dawg
junior member
junior member
 
Posts: 5
Joined: 24 Aug 2017 07:51

United States of America

PreviousNext

Return to Turntables and Tonearms