Technics sp10 or clearaudio

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mudpy
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by mudpy » 16 Jun 2019 15:31

I ve always heard the sp 10 are one of the best if not the best thats why i narrowed down to that and the clearaudio. There are so many turntables its not easy to make the choise . im willing to spend no more than 4000 and i basically want the best sound i can get for that money but with so many tt its hard to know
I will be using it just for home use no djing


Nigel Gomez
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by Nigel Gomez » 16 Jun 2019 18:05

You can buy a used SP 10 but ONLY if you can check it out in person and transport it yourself.

If it doesn't HAVE to be one of those two then look at other options in that price range.

https://karaokebananza.com/best-turntab ... 3000-5000/

Legrace
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by Legrace » 16 Jun 2019 18:16

Have you noticed the SP10MK2 listed on canuckaudiomart?

Sunwire
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by Sunwire » 16 Jun 2019 19:07

SP10Mk2s are extremely common. No way in the world would I pay $2700 for one. The description of the turntable is also inconsistent. He says it includes the Technics arm, but also says it includes the Micro Seiki arm.
Shipping of these motor units is not simple. The motor needs to be secured properly. They originally came with a metal clamp, but most owners have lost them. It's possible to use cardboard and packing tape to perform the clamping function, but you have to know what you're doing.

Prices have gone up steadily. The most I paid was $800 and that was for an extremely rare model with pitch control (I've never seen another one). The first one I got was $200 or $300, I think. The last one I got (about a year ago) was $700 with the obsidian base and an SME 3009 S2 tonearm. It had a very ugly dustcover, however, and no power supply.
So, it's still possible to get a bargain, but you have to be extremely patient. And if you want one in pristine condition, it's going to be expensive. I don't really care about the looks too much.
I checked ebay every day (email saved search notifications) for years to find my most recent purchase and I drove about ten hours each way to pick it up because I didn't want it damaged in shipping.

If you can afford it, I'd buy one of the new SL-1200GRs before I'd buy an SP-10 at the prices many are asking today.
You know it's going to be brand new and probably serviceable for many years with parts available.
The boutique turntables may be great, but how long will the companies be in business?

mudpy
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by mudpy » 16 Jun 2019 22:04

Thanks for the advice

cafe latte
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by cafe latte » 17 Jun 2019 11:16

Sunwire wrote:
16 Jun 2019 19:07
SP10Mk2s are extremely common. No way in the world would I pay $2700 for one. The description of the turntable is also inconsistent. He says it includes the Technics arm, but also says it includes the Micro Seiki arm.
Shipping of these motor units is not simple. The motor needs to be secured properly. They originally came with a metal clamp, but most owners have lost them. It's possible to use cardboard and packing tape to perform the clamping function, but you have to know what you're doing.

Prices have gone up steadily. The most I paid was $800 and that was for an extremely rare model with pitch control (I've never seen another one). The first one I got was $200 or $300, I think. The last one I got (about a year ago) was $700 with the obsidian base and an SME 3009 S2 tonearm. It had a very ugly dustcover, however, and no power supply.
So, it's still possible to get a bargain, but you have to be extremely patient. And if you want one in pristine condition, it's going to be expensive. I don't really care about the looks too much.
I checked ebay every day (email saved search notifications) for years to find my most recent purchase and I drove about ten hours each way to pick it up because I didn't want it damaged in shipping.

If you can afford it, I'd buy one of the new SL-1200GRs before I'd buy an SP-10 at the prices many are asking today.
You know it's going to be brand new and probably serviceable for many years with parts available.
The boutique turntables may be great, but how long will the companies be in business?
Don't totally agree, but do with some. SP10 can be locked for transport better than most turntables you just need to make sure seller does it. I am sure the GR,s are well made but the SP10 mk2 is a Serious piece of kit. Getting a cheap working one is fine if the buyer can fix it up, I can, but possibly better for some to spend the money and get an sp10mk2 that has had a recap etc done.
Chris

mudpy
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by mudpy » 17 Jun 2019 11:23

I saw the one on canuck but it comes with no arm and that alone can be very expensive

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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by Legrace » 17 Jun 2019 13:20

mudpy wrote:
17 Jun 2019 11:23
I saw the one on canuck but it comes with no arm and that alone can be very expensive
The fact it comes w/o an arm is a plus in my book. When I set out on a similar path I opted for a Denon DP-80 drive, a close competitor of the SP10. Drive only listings tend to sit around a lot longer, as most folks are looking for a complete solution. So you can typically get quite good deals on these. Which was true in my case, the listing had been up for a long time.

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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by tlscapital » 18 Jun 2019 07:19

Legrace wrote:
17 Jun 2019 13:20
mudpy wrote:
17 Jun 2019 11:23
I saw the one on canuck but it comes with no arm and that alone can be very expensive
The fact it comes w/o an arm is a plus in my book. When I set out on a similar path I opted for a Denon DP-80 drive, a close competitor of the SP10. Drive only listings tend to sit around a lot longer, as most folks are looking for a complete solution. So you can typically get quite good deals on these. Which was true in my case, the listing had been up for a long time.
Fully agree with 'Legrace'. I'd be only incline to purchase one "nude" if I was intending to. That but admitting one knows what better/different tonearm he/she seek to couple it with and with what specific cartridge already if ever...

mudpy
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by mudpy » 18 Jun 2019 11:52

Which arm would be a good choice?

cafe latte
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by cafe latte » 18 Jun 2019 12:10

mudpy wrote:
18 Jun 2019 11:52
Which arm would be a good choice?
Depends on budget. I have an Eminent Technology on mine, but also Jelco which are a lot cheaper are really good, as I have a,12 inch Jelco on another turntable (you will need at least a 10 inch arm for arm mounting in traditional position).
Sme 309 are supposed to be fantastic too on sp10's but again odd mounting position so the 10 inch version probably better option. Most decent arms IMO should be fine as long as plinth is right and as long as they fit.
Chris

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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by akimmet » 18 Jun 2019 15:49

Sunwire wrote:
16 Jun 2019 19:07
SP10Mk2s are extremely common. No way in the world would I pay $2700 for one. The description of the turntable is also inconsistent. He says it includes the Technics arm, but also says it includes the Micro Seiki arm.
Shipping of these motor units is not simple. The motor needs to be secured properly. They originally came with a metal clamp, but most owners have lost them. It's possible to use cardboard and packing tape to perform the clamping function, but you have to know what you're doing.

Prices have gone up steadily. The most I paid was $800 and that was for an extremely rare model with pitch control (I've never seen another one). The first one I got was $200 or $300, I think. The last one I got (about a year ago) was $700 with the obsidian base and an SME 3009 S2 tonearm. It had a very ugly dustcover, however, and no power supply.
So, it's still possible to get a bargain, but you have to be extremely patient. And if you want one in pristine condition, it's going to be expensive. I don't really care about the looks too much.
I checked ebay every day (email saved search notifications) for years to find my most recent purchase and I drove about ten hours each way to pick it up because I didn't want it damaged in shipping.

If you can afford it, I'd buy one of the new SL-1200GRs before I'd buy an SP-10 at the prices many are asking today.
You know it's going to be brand new and probably serviceable for many years with parts available.
The boutique turntables may be great, but how long will the companies be in business?
I’m also going to disagree, SP-10s and SL-1000s aren’t extremely common. However, they aren’t exactly rare either. Prices these days are a little over $1000 US for a MK2 or MK2A in known good cosmetic and operating condition. The MK3 models trade for much more, over $2500. The prices you mentioned are unrealistic unless you are extremely lucky.

While mentioned already, keep an eye out for other broadcast direct drives from Denon and JVC Victor, these had similar specs but don’t demand as high of prices.

I totally agree about about waiting for a turntable that you can pick-up yourself! The shipping would be extremely expensive for such a extra heavy turntable, and unrepairable damage is likely.

Sunwire
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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by Sunwire » 18 Jun 2019 20:37

There are over 20 SP-10s for sale on ebay right now.
I call that extremely common.
The SL-1000 is not extremely common, but there are 6 for sale on ebay right now.

I didn't say the prices I paid were realistic today. They aren't, unless you are extremely patient and lucky, as I said. And you have to accept cosmetic imperfections.

I am a cheapskate and I already have way too many turntables, so I'm in a different situation. I can afford to wait for a super bargain.

If you're going to pay the price for a known good condition SL-1000, I think the new SL-1200 is worth looking at. That's all I'm saying.

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Re: Technics sp10 or clearaudio

Post by ]eep » 20 Jun 2019 02:42

A turntable for broadcast use is not the best you get for home use and vice versa. Or dj use. The demands on it are just too different. In my experience, in my opinion and from what I hear direct drives do not sound good -at all-. It doesn't sound natural, the reproduction of acoustic venue is veiled, sounds don't fall off naturally but are halted. You may call it 'dynamic' but that's not what it is. It's more like truncated. For music on the radio with limited bandwidth and tons of dynamic compression that's no problem. There's music that isn't bothered by it, but acoustic music like jazz or classical. It's not the best choice.

The POM Clearaudio uses for its platters comes closest to vinyl in Youngs modulus so it causes less unwanted reflections. The weight makes it impervious to airborne interference and has a large angular moment of inertia so it doesn't cog, flutter or jitter so slow fading tones die of naturally with a 'black' background (ie no background noise). And the magnetic bearing with ceramic non-bearing spindle is as close to physically perfect as possible. Their motors are very good, there's not much force needed to keep the heavy platter going. And their arms are very good. Cartridges too, but I guess you better make your own choice. There's so many.

I think it's ridiculous to brush off Clearaudio as if it were just 1 turntable. Like 'a Crossley'. They make turntables at the price of a modest house. Their German engineering is the best in the world. Just brushing it of as if it were rubbish is plain ignorant, not to say biased and dumb. Or compare the whole range with their most dressed down version, that is just unfair.

And how is comparing the cheapest model, new TT against a 2ndH former top model ever fair. Why not compare it to a 2ndH Clearaudio Performance, DC or better? Apples and oranges... Maybe those are much rarer? And why would that be?

I know that there are lots of fanboys of Technics DD TT and they will always tell you they are 'the best there is'. I guess it's up to you to decide if that's true. For me my Performance simply sounds very, very good. And I've heard many turntables, really expensive too. Mine could be improved upon but there's always better. At a price. But mine does not wear, age or deteriorate. The melamine is a very durable polymer and if not scratched only shows a natural old sheen. Once set up it just works as it should. No colored lights, no clickety clack, nothing 'automatic'. Just music. In that sense it's more Japanese than Technics. Maybe that's why it matchrs so well with my Koetsu, Kiseki, AT and Dynavector?