Universal bearing oil

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Teknokid
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Universal bearing oil

Post by Teknokid » 10 Oct 2018 17:38

Hi guys,

Beating a dead horse here, and yes I've searched before posting. I'm restoring a couple of turntables (models below) and am seeking advice on bearing oil. After searching and reading on the site and the web I'm getting mixed opinions on bearing oil. Is there such a thing as universal bearing oil? Short answer is likely no, but I'm hoping to avoid buying multiple types for the turntables I'm working on. On the other hand, I also don't want to chance ruining any TT's by not following spec. Can anyone recommend a bearing oil that is close enough for rock and roll?

So far I'm leaning towards:
1. Anderol 465 Synthetic Bearing Oil
2. Zoom Spout turbine oil
3. Liquid Bearing
4. Singer sewing machine Oil

Models are as follows: Akai AP-B20C belt drive, Sears Professional series belt drive (likely made by CEC), NEC AU-6500 direct drive, Pioneer PL-520 direct drive, Pioneer PL-514 belt drive.

Spinner45
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Spinner45 » 10 Oct 2018 17:53

2) Zoom - it's ALL you'll need.
Don't make yourself crazy over it.
I've been servicing turntables, tape decks, etc for decades, from experience, I ought to know.

Teknokid
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Teknokid » 10 Oct 2018 18:01

Thanks for the recommendation! I haven't heard anything bad about Zoom, and seems to be easier to find than Anderol so I may go that route.

totem
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by totem » 10 Oct 2018 18:09

I have seen more than 1 Zoom type, the one I have used was bought through an HVAC supplier
for use in sleeve bearing circulation pumps.

JDJX
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by JDJX » 10 Oct 2018 19:36

I have been using "Liquid Bearings" oil for a few years now.... on my "Thorens 165" and my "Pioneer 112D" with great results.

I really like this oil.
it is a 100 true synthetic with no additives.... of the proper viscosity . :)

This is the oil that I got...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Liquid-Bearing ... :rk:2:pf:0

No TT manufacture use any special oil. They just used a suitable oil available at time of manufacture... and that is what they recommend in the original literature.
IMO, a true synthetic oil is better than any oil used at the time of a vintage TT's manufacture. :)

BTW ....

"Turbine Oil Formulation

Turbine oil formulations are relatively simple; they are a mixture of the following ingredients: Base oil, corrosion inhibitors, oxidation inhibitors, defoamants, and demulsifiers. The base oil is usually 97 percent or more of the turbine oil formula. Additives are blended into the base oil at low levels to protect both the oil and the turbine parts. Additives should be chosen so that they provide optimized performance in the turbine, per OEM requirements. However, many newer turbine oils have been formulated with base oils that were refined with newer techniques. Most laboratory bench test data indicate that the use of these new base fluids should provide longer lubricant life in field applications. Unfortunately, this has not been found to be true. In addition to the newer base fluids, studies have linked certain antioxidant combinations to the formation of sludge and varnish."


Personally, I would never use turbine oil

Teknokid
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Teknokid » 10 Oct 2018 20:36

Excellent explanation and thanks for replying! I've seen mixed reviews on Liquid Bearing, which seems odd as it seems to be quite popular.

Spinner45
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Spinner45 » 10 Oct 2018 23:04

Teknokid wrote:Excellent explanation and thanks for replying! I've seen mixed reviews on Liquid Bearing, which seems odd as it seems to be quite popular.
That's because it's an overpriced, overhyped "ebay" product dreamed up to make someone rich.
Stick with something a "real" manufacturer, someone with a long reputation of good products makes.
Zoom's been around long before ebay and the internet.

Teknokid
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Teknokid » 11 Oct 2018 00:12

For me, Liquid Bearings would be less money than Zoom due to shipping. That being said, I've heard claims that Liquid Bearings is just synthetic gear oil repackaged (one of the less than positive reviews). If there is any truth to that claim, I can pick up a lifetime supply locally for peanuts. Though I don't know how comfortable I would feel putting Automotive Gear on a TT.

cafe latte
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by cafe latte » 11 Oct 2018 00:15

JDJX wrote:I have been using "Liquid Bearings" oil for a few years now.... on my "Thorens 165" and my "Pioneer 112D" with great results.

I really like this oil.
it is a 100 true synthetic with no additives.... of the proper viscosity . :)

This is the oil that I got...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Liquid-Bearing ... :rk:2:pf:0

No TT manufacture use any special oil. They just used a suitable oil available at time of manufacture... and that is what they recommend in the original literature.
IMO, a true synthetic oil is better than any oil used at the time of a vintage TT's manufacture. :)

BTW ....

"Turbine Oil Formulation

Turbine oil formulations are relatively simple; they are a mixture of the following ingredients: Base oil, corrosion inhibitors, oxidation inhibitors, defoamants, and demulsifiers. The base oil is usually 97 percent or more of the turbine oil formula. Additives are blended into the base oil at low levels to protect both the oil and the turbine parts. Additives should be chosen so that they provide optimized performance in the turbine, per OEM requirements. However, many newer turbine oils have been formulated with base oils that were refined with newer techniques. Most laboratory bench test data indicate that the use of these new base fluids should provide longer lubricant life in field applications. Unfortunately, this has not been found to be true. In addition to the newer base fluids, studies have linked certain antioxidant combinations to the formation of sludge and varnish."


Personally, I would never use turbine oil
Anderol 465 Synthetic Bearing Oil is turbine oil and it was recommended for Technics. Also your turntable bearing is never going to spin like a turbine unless something is very wrong :D
Chris

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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by cafe latte » 11 Oct 2018 00:16

Also compressor oil (synthetic) are perfect for the job too. Sewing machine oil is way way too thin.
Chris

Teknokid
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Teknokid » 11 Oct 2018 00:33

Thanks Chris,

I did not know that Zoom and Anderol are both turbine oil but have seen each recommended on other posts here. If Anderol is similar to Zoom, than it may just come down to price and availability to determine which one I go for. I found Anderol cheapest at a pellet stove supplier. The Technics-recommended packaged Anderol found through a TT accessory/part supplier was kind of pricey by comparison.

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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Teknokid » 11 Oct 2018 00:35

Teknokid wrote:For me, Liquid Bearings would be less money than Zoom due to shipping. That being said, I've heard claims that Liquid Bearings is just synthetic gear oil repackaged (one of the less than positive reviews). If there is any truth to that claim, I can pick up a lifetime supply locally for peanuts. Though I don't know how comfortable I would feel putting Automotive Gear on a TT.
Perhaps I should have read more on this before posting. It appears that Liquid Bearings addressed this claim on their webpage:

Q: Why not use other oils I see for sale cheaper on the internet?
A: Re-packaged motor oil – Some unscrupulous opportunists re-package common-grade motor oil into small bottles, attach a label, and resell it on places like eBay for many different applications. It might be fine for some applications, but it also may very well contain many additives that are harmful over time for plastic components, such as gears and bushings that are common in many types of vintage and modern devices. Only use oils that are fully tested and guaranteed to be 100% plastic-safe, like Liquid Bearings.

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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by JDJX » 11 Oct 2018 00:56

Spinner45 wrote:
Teknokid wrote:Excellent explanation and thanks for replying! I've seen mixed reviews on Liquid Bearing, which seems odd as it seems to be quite popular.
That's because it's an overpriced, overhyped "ebay" product dreamed up to make someone rich.
Stick with something a "real" manufacturer, someone with a long reputation of good products makes.
Zoom's been around long before ebay and the internet.
Any oil is from a "real manufacture". Also any oil is from bulk and repackaged is various small size containers.
Also , any merchant is out to make money... if all they are selling is hot dogs. :)

As far as TT oil....
It's just like everything else in audio. There are fan boys and serial bashers for any given piece of audio hardware. :)

When all is said and done, we are lubricating a TT spindle......not turbine bearings. The two needs are a bit different.
Yes, turbine oil will work for a spindle bearing but, it is really the best oil to use in lieu of modern 100% synthetics ?

ChrisfromRI
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by ChrisfromRI » 11 Oct 2018 01:41

IMO pretty much any Synthetic 20W Oil would be fine for a turntable main bearing, and Anderol 465 is essentially a 20W Synthetic with a super high temperature rating. I happened to buy a quart of if to seasonally lubricate the bearings of a fireplace grate blower (that operates in a very hot environment in the fireplace where the temperature rating actually matters). It wasn't very expensive to get a whole quart so now I have a long term supply.

I actually use a much lighter weight (thinner) synthetic oil for tape capstans and motor bearings.

Spinner45
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Re: Universal bearing oil

Post by Spinner45 » 11 Oct 2018 02:46

JDJX wrote:
Spinner45 wrote:
Teknokid wrote:Excellent explanation and thanks for replying! I've seen mixed reviews on Liquid Bearing, which seems odd as it seems to be quite popular.
That's because it's an overpriced, overhyped "ebay" product dreamed up to make someone rich.
Stick with something a "real" manufacturer, someone with a long reputation of good products makes.
Zoom's been around long before ebay and the internet.
Any oil is from a "real manufacture". Also any oil is from bulk and repackaged is various small size containers.
Also , any merchant is out to make money... if all they are selling is hot dogs. :)

As far as TT oil....
It's just like everything else in audio. There are fan boys and serial bashers for any given piece of audio hardware. :)

When all is said and done, we are lubricating a TT spindle......not turbine bearings. The two needs are a bit different.
Yes, turbine oil will work for a spindle bearing but, it is really the best oil to use in lieu of modern 100% synthetics ?
I've nothing against synthetic lubricants.
Hell, I use Super Lube grease on mechanical assemblies all the time, and it's synthetic.
But for light oil, I've been using Zoom for decades, and never, never had any issues due to using it.
And believe me, I've been through plenty of lubricants over the years to decide what I prefer.

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