Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

turning japanese
Shadowman82
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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by Shadowman82 » 14 Oct 2019 21:12

Cool !

gpjgonzo
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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by gpjgonzo » 20 Oct 2019 01:57

SchillerM wrote:
15 Sep 2019 20:49
Disappointed in the rubber mat thickness, vs the MK2 it's very thin and light weight.
Matt
I ended up putting the Technics thick mat on my 1210GR only to improve the VTA. The arm is more horizontal with the thick mat:
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Sterling1
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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by Sterling1 » 20 Oct 2019 10:45

gpjgonzo wrote:
20 Oct 2019 01:57
SchillerM wrote:
15 Sep 2019 20:49
Disappointed in the rubber mat thickness, vs the MK2 it's very thin and light weight.
Matt
I ended up putting the Technics thick mat on my 1210GR only to improve the VTA. The arm is more horizontal with the thick mat:
The mat furnished on the GR is ideal for 18mm tall cartridges. I have several 15mm tall carts and thus the furnished mat is not ideal and the only fix is cartridge shimming and/or a thicker mat. I decided shimming would be more appropriate and thus I placed a 2mm shim between cart and headshell to end up with a 17mm high cart which levels at the 0 VTA adjustment position. I do not believe there's any evidence out there that the properties of a thicker mat effect the character of the sound from the record. However, I do know that while a thicker mat may better level a cartridge that is less than 17mm tall, the result may still require shimming and/or re-adjustment of VTA for the best sound from the record. This is why I chose to just shim as required to get an exacting result solely from the TT's VTA adjustment feature.
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Shadowman82
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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by Shadowman82 » 20 Oct 2019 23:02

I always wondered why Technics chooses to supply the GR and G with the thinner mat . I guess they feel with the new platter being better they don't need a thick mat . That being said if I ever got a GR or G you bet I would keep the thicker mat of my old SL-1200 as well .

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by gpjgonzo » 21 Oct 2019 06:50

Shadowman82 wrote:
20 Oct 2019 23:02
I always wondered why Technics chooses to supply the GR and G with the thinner mat . I guess they feel with the new platter being better they don't need a thick mat . That being said if I ever got a GR or G you bet I would keep the thicker mat of my old SL-1200 as well .
I am not worried about damping as the platter is indeed stellar. What bothers me with the thin mat is the VTA. The arm can't be lowered enough, it bottoms out.

My Denon DL-301MK2 has a height of 18mm when going by the diagram on page 20 in the manual. The manual says to set the height control at setting 1. At the same time the illustration on the same page says to keep the tonearm parallel to the record. :?:

There is way too much angle at setting 1. A little better at setting zero but still angled. It is only when I use the Technics thick mat when the arm is acceptably parallel to the record.

Edit: One thing I didn't think of though, is that I am not using the Technics head shell and the mounting surface is most likely lower (closer to the platter) than my Orsonic shell .... that has to be it ....

Shadowman82
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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by Shadowman82 » 21 Oct 2019 22:35

Yeah that would be different if you are using a different headshell . But anyway using the thicker mat won't hurt anything .

lensmanMK2
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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by lensmanMK2 » 16 Nov 2019 20:21

heard one of these last weekend... i want one!

what worries me is the main bearing,namely lubrication in years to come,phoned panasonic and was told it doesnt require lubrication,maybe true for the short term,but in a few years even if its sintered or sealed it will for sure.

so have any of you guys come across a cut away of the motor/bearing assembly,if so does it look like it can be "unofficially" relubed fairly simply?

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by Sterling1 » 17 Nov 2019 07:21

lensmanMK2 wrote:
16 Nov 2019 20:21
heard one of these last weekend... i want one!

what worries me is the main bearing,namely lubrication in years to come,phoned panasonic and was told it doesnt require lubrication,maybe true for the short term,but in a few years even if its sintered or sealed it will for sure.

so have any of you guys come across a cut away of the motor/bearing assembly,if so does it look like it can be "unofficially" relubed fairly simply?
Why not believe Panasonic and just follow their recommended maintenance, page 25? Or, buy a TT whose maintenance schedule does require lubrication.

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by lensmanMK2 » 17 Nov 2019 16:38

dont think you understand what im talking about sterling,cleaning the dust cover and cart terminals wont prolong the bearing life for sure.

a lot of the old japanese high end direct drives came with "sealed" bearings,but stripping them down usually shows the oil has long gone and the spindle and bush were badly scored,platter would still turn no problem but the sound quality was nowhere near a unit that still had some in and had escaped the damage.

theres better things nowadays like ptfe epoxy bearings,but it all depends if technics have used it,or just gone with a simple limited life sintered bearing.

its a great sounding and looking turntable for sure,and id love one.but if ive got to fork out over a grand for something that might start to deteriorate in as short as 6years probably worth getting a 2nd hand 1200 and fitting a timestep bearing.

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by audiopile » 17 Nov 2019 17:08

Take a look at what Kevin at KAB has done for spindle bearings/thrust plates on the SL-1200/SL-150 MkII/M-1 (NOT the new 1200 "G"series)- he's come up with a outright silly cheap ,easy replacement for the only part on these classics that predictably wore out with use -the spindle thrust plate. KAB's replacement thrust plates (two versions are available for different generations of 1200 series tables) -are made from a "plastic" that is as slippery as ceramic . A routinely replaced part has become a lifetime replacement. I've got a 1200GAE here -but being a lazy former audio tech - not nearly curious enough to take a perfectly working table apart - but wonder if this might be where Kevin got the idea ? The trouble with lube is that unless it's in a really sealed environment -it attracts stuff! out of the air. Eventually it transitions thru a few stages -let's call them gummy to gritty. Won't tell you I'm not curious about the G series spindle thrust plate - but it might be runnin dry ?

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by Sterling1 » 17 Nov 2019 17:23

lensmanMK2 wrote:
17 Nov 2019 16:38
dont think you understand what im talking about sterling,cleaning the dust cover and cart terminals wont prolong the bearing life for sure.

a lot of the old japanese high end direct drives came with "sealed" bearings,but stripping them down usually shows the oil has long gone and the spindle and bush were badly scored,platter would still turn no problem but the sound quality was nowhere near a unit that still had some in and had escaped the damage.

theres better things nowadays like ptfe epoxy bearings,but it all depends if technics have used it,or just gone with a simple limited life sintered bearing.

its a great sounding and looking turntable for sure,and id love one.but if ive got to fork out over a grand for something that might start to deteriorate in as short as 6years probably worth getting a 2nd hand 1200 and fitting a timestep bearing.
No, I understand. You do not believe what Panasonic told you; therefore, you're still concerned that your investment will not have the desired outcome. The solution is don't buy the Technics. Buy something else which better assures satisfaction.

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by lensmanMK2 » 17 Nov 2019 19:12

no sterling youre not understanding me bud.

im looking for more info to see if its worth the purchase,and whether it will last.

ive demo'd a few turntables and the GR came out the best in that price range,its like buying a new BMW with a so called "filled for life" gearbox,when in fact what they mean is it goes pop at 100K and you need to get it rebuilt,when a gearbox you can service can go for a lot longer.

if theyve used ptfe epoxy bearings in the GR i would buy one for sure,but sintered no chance,all depends what info i can dig up.

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by audiopile » 17 Nov 2019 21:01

The G's do allow the two drops along the platter/spindle interface every 2000? hours of use. In the many 1200's that have come thru Mo's shelter for neglected /abused SL-1200's over the years - right off hand- I don't remember ever encountering a worn out spindle -even tho I'd bet some were lubricated with rum n coke way more often than with any kind of oil. One bent platter (gotta be a story there?). The only G model I've heard so far is mine -it is really very quiet. How much of that is arm or spindle/thrust plate or base and feet- isolaters -don't know .

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by Sterling1 » 17 Nov 2019 23:15

lensmanMK2 wrote:
17 Nov 2019 19:12
no sterling youre not understanding me bud.

im looking for more info to see if its worth the purchase,and whether it will last.

ive demo'd a few turntables and the GR came out the best in that price range,its like buying a new BMW with a so called "filled for life" gearbox,when in fact what they mean is it goes pop at 100K and you need to get it rebuilt,when a gearbox you can service can go for a lot longer.

if theyve used ptfe epoxy bearings in the GR i would buy one for sure,but sintered no chance,all depends what info i can dig up.
So, give em another call.

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Re: Technics SL-1200GR Worth Every Penny

Post by cafe latte » 18 Nov 2019 05:36

I am sure it is possible to lube the G.
Chris