AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

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valkyr2003
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AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by valkyr2003 » 14 Aug 2019 08:33

Hi all,
Can anyone advise if it is possible to replace AT95E by Ortofon OM series catridge in LP120USB? Will it be a good combination in terms of cart compliance and LP120 tonearm effective weight? I cannot make an exact conclusion after comparison of these two cartidges specs. :(
Many thanks in advance!

Pauw
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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by Pauw » 14 Aug 2019 09:32

The AT 95 has a medium compliance and the OM 10 upwards are high compliance cartridges .... :D

If you look on The vinylengine site you will find a compliance/effective mass calculator, that will help you with such problems...Use this will the arm and cartridge data bases and you can get an answer for most cartridges. :D

valkyr2003
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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by valkyr2003 » 14 Aug 2019 10:39

Thank you. However the issue is that there is no any information about LP120USB tonearm effective mass in the database. I can tell you enen more - for example you can easily find the effective length and overhang for the LP120USB tonerarm here (forum) and in many other places but it is not in the VE tonearm database. :D
So, I will simply try to install Ortofon OM.

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by Pauw » 14 Aug 2019 11:30

You can do a good estimate with a digital scale...... weigh the arm at the tip (arm horizontal) with counterweight and cartridge removed. ....that will give a good estimate.

valkyr2003
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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by valkyr2003 » 14 Aug 2019 12:52

This is really good idea, thank you!
However, it seems that there is some other way to find the information.:) I searched the Support page at ortofon.com and found a calculator for cartridge replacement. There is AT-LP120XUSB model in the list and Ortofon recommendation is to use OM5E and OM1S.

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by cats squirrel » 14 Aug 2019 13:47

I think that may be a better match, but those carts are at the bottom of the pond in terms of sound quality, IMHO. Ortofon said they were dull, and I would agree. The AT95E is a better match and can produce better quality sound, I have found. If you invest in one of the new design AT95E, there is a well described upgrade path, too. However, the old AT95E is a good all rounder. I'm not sure what the AT -LP120X is capable of, but I would guess you wouldn't get too far up the upgrade path with it.

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by Pauw » 14 Aug 2019 14:35

"Ortofon said they were dull, and I would agree" cats squirrel.......Can you show evidence of that quote from Ortofon please? I have never seen such a quote...

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM v AT-LP120USB

Post by Rumburak » 14 Aug 2019 17:29

Používám na AT-LP120USB cartridge ortofon 2M blue a zní to krásně

cats squirrel
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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by cats squirrel » 14 Aug 2019 19:48

Pauw wrote:
14 Aug 2019 14:35
"Ortofon said they were dull, and I would agree" cats squirrel.......Can you show evidence of that quote from Ortofon please? I have never seen such a quote...
no, I can't, but I remember it was in a review of OM carts, where the reviewer said he found the sound rather dull, and said 'even Ortofon said so'.

It might be that the sound can be improved by better load matching, 400pF being suggested as optimal.

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by Pauw » 14 Aug 2019 20:13

Well, I think then it might be wise not to keep quoting this because it is clearly something you can't substantiate !

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by cats squirrel » 15 Aug 2019 00:09

Pauw wrote:
14 Aug 2019 20:13
Well, I think then it might be wise not to keep quoting this because it is clearly something you can't substantiate !
well, it's the nature of the beast (audio forums). People mouth off about all sorts of rubbish without a shred of evidence.

BUT, I found the Ortofon OM5 and 10 to be dull (as well as the reviewer) and I decided to change them for something better. I think I bought a Goldring 1042, which was better (my opinion).

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by cats squirrel » 06 Oct 2019 23:00

Pauw wrote:
14 Aug 2019 20:13
Well, I think then it might be wise not to keep quoting this because it is clearly something you can't substantiate !
I have found the article (quite by chance, I wasn't looking for it just for you!).

It appeared in "Hi-Fi World" January 2008, page 31, in a description of the Ortofon 2M Black (winner of the Cartridge award for that year). I quote:

" ...further down in the range it was still doing derivatives of its late 1970's OM series -- all of which possessed a pleasantly smooth but unfailingly bland sound... To the company's credit, Ortofon had the good grace to admit this..."

Nuff said?

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by Pauw » 07 Oct 2019 09:10

cats squirrel wrote:
06 Oct 2019 23:00
Pauw wrote:
14 Aug 2019 20:13
Well, I think then it might be wise not to keep quoting this because it is clearly something you can't substantiate !
I have found the article (quite by chance, I wasn't looking for it just for you!).

It appeared in "Hi-Fi World" January 2008, page 31, in a description of the Ortofon 2M Black (winner of the Cartridge award for that year). I quote:

" ...further down in the range it was still doing derivatives of its late 1970's OM series -- all of which possessed a pleasantly smooth but unfailingly bland sound... To the company's credit, Ortofon had the good grace to admit this..."

Nuff said?
I have researched with several search engines and I can not find the article you try to reference...there is one a year earlier which refers to the 2M bronze and mentions the black in that article.....mmmmm [-X

https://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/index.php/ ... ml?start=1

Note this passage ............"Both the Bronze and Black have a measured frequency response that mimics the Red and Blue, with a steady upward trend toward high frequencies. This is unusual and results in a distinctive presentation that gives swathes of detail and seemingly impressive insight, but also a sound diametrically opposite to that of yore; instead of warm and cuddly, you get a brightly lit midband that isn’t kind to old, worn discs in particular, nor to older recordings, although the Black curiously transcends this basic characteristic of the Red, Blue and Bronze, I found.

Spinning a new 180gm pressing of Elvis singing 'It’s Now or Never', with the Bronze in place, I was struck not so much by the depth and expressiveness of his voice, but by a lightness of balance and sense of hardness in the recording. Okay, it was recorded back in 1960 and the Bronze is actually picking up on the deficiencies of the recording equipment, but I have never heard Elvis presented like this before; we likely all think of Elvis as having a rich, mellow voice, but the Bronze wagged its finger at me and suggested otherwise. ""

This seems to say that this magazine says the opposite and why would they change their mind so dramatically after a year and quote Ortofon to endorse this? :D

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Re: AT95E vs Ortofon OM in AT-LP120USB

Post by yarvelling » 21 Oct 2019 22:46

It all rather depends on which Ortofon cartridge that you wish to install..... As a general rule-of-thumb, Ortofon cartridges have a 'warmer', more mid-range presentation to their overall sound, though they can also have a nice, bright treble too.
The original Audio Technica AT95E has a different sound signature; it is more evenly balanced, with a more 'clinical' edge... less mid-range, and an extended treble/high frequencies: - also dependant on your phono pre-amp, and it's capacitance loading.
Personally, I favour the more clean/clinical sound from Audio Technica - it also comes over with more more dynamic 'punch'..... Especially the 'lesser' AT3600 and the new AT-VM95E; These carts sound exceptional for their price-brackets.....

You can indeed mount an ortofon OM series cartridge into a standard headshell, and set it up on an AT-LP120, but from personal experience, I don't think it's worth it.... the AT cartridge just sounds all-round 'better' to me, and the new VM series is a BIG improvement....

However.... sound quality is subjective! So I would say "experiment" if you already have the cartridges.... see which you prefer.... Have fun! :-)

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