SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

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IndigoRock2001
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SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by IndigoRock2001 » 18 Jul 2018 17:14

Sorry this is a duplicate post. I moved it here which is more appropriate but didn't know how to delete it in "music" where I originally posted it. IR [-X

Well I think it's obvious that SACD is a dead format. I guess what I want to know is,,,, does anyone know of a place which has a large catalogue of them. I've checked out some places which only offer classical SACD's, others who's catalogue is about 10 of them. I think I'm most interested in R&R. I've seen quite a few Stones CD's (SACD's) but i don't really like the Stones enough to invest in them. Oddly there is a lot of 70's people like Ry Cooder etc. Yuck! I'm bidding on a Tommy 2 SACD set on Ebay. Something with some depth of music is the only thing that makes sense to me. I know Dark Side of the Moon is avail, but really I can play that album in my head I've heard it so often. Is there really just not that much out there on SACD? or am I just not finding the mother load? I like the multichannel potential of SACD's true quad! finally. But now it's dead, I mean the format. I still don't really understand why Dolby 5.1 or 7.1 can't be encoded into the stereo of a regular CD. Is it a licensing thing? or a technical one. I just know that my NetFlix channel produced Dolby 7.1 from 2 stereo channels. I think. Maybe there's more to it. I've always been fascinated by multi-channel recordings, starting in the 70's with my fathers Quad setup. It didn't work really but the potential fascinated me. Anyone want to muse on this stuff? I'd appreciate it.
indi

analogaudio
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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by analogaudio » 18 Jul 2018 18:20

The reason CD didn't have surround capability is two fold. One is technical, surround recordings contain more information than stereo ones. In order to fit the extra information on the standard CD the playing time would have to be reduced, significantly. Secondly, when CD was introduced in 1982 surround sound as we know it today didn't exist. Recording facilities were arranged for production of stereo material. QUAD was an experiment that didn't work very well and died quickly. In order to make surround out of stereo some clever electronic tricks are required and these were uncommon and expensive. By the 1990s some progress had been made with digital signal processing and surround equipment started to be found in recording facilities, especially for movies. Also technical advances with CD made possible multichannel sound and digital video discs. Put these two together and you have SACD, I seem to recall this was around 2000. Home theater started to become possible and it was home theater that made possible for many people the purchase of the multi-channel amplification and multi-channel loudspeakers that are required are are now commonplace. Inside a typical home theater receiver is digital signal processing of astonishing complexity compared to CD playback. It is now trivial to create a surround sound effect at home from a stereo recording using a home theater receiver this is done automatically and is the same thing that Netflix does.

circularvibes
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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by circularvibes » 18 Jul 2018 18:25

Anyone who thinks SACD is dead hasn't been to https://www.duttonvocalion.co.uk/. They release classic quad albums at a couple every couple months along with classical. SACD was never a popular format, but it isn't dead. It does tend to be more classical and jazz, but there are places to look for pop titles. Audio Fidelity released many titles before their demise earlier this year. Check out stores like Deep Discount, Import CDs and Exclusive Disc for more. Otherwise, there is still https://www.hraudio.net/ for reviews with links to sale sites, and http://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/index.php for revies, news and discussion on Hi-Res formats and multichannel sound.

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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by raphaelmabo » 18 Jul 2018 19:08

A multichannel CD with Dolby wouldn't be a CD, not a "red book CD". Red Book refers to a set of professional specifications for audio CD's, it's called "red book" because the book that published the technical specification for the standard CD had a red cover. :) All CD-players can handle "red book CD". So a CD with multichannel audio won't be a CD anymore and it would need special decoding equipment.

Now, there's two solutions to that: DVD Audio and SACD. :)
I always preferred SACD, and I can use it in my Pioneer multiformat player.

circularvibes
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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by circularvibes » 18 Jul 2018 20:03

Actually, there are Dolby matrix encoded CD's and they do conform to RBCD standards. They are playable in 2 channel, or using a Dolby decoder, it will be 5.1. There are also quad matrix encoded CD's as well, but you likely need a knowledgeable list to tell you which ones they are. The only thing not utilised in the RBCD standard was the 4 channel discrete format. This is because quad as a popular format was regrettably dead by 1980. There were also DTS encoded cd's in the RBCD standard, but you require a DTS decoder to hear them. You get loud white noise otherwise. They are not 2 channel compatible, but conform only because the sound is still in the 2 channels waiting for decoding. Most older DVD players and multichannel receivers had DTS built in.

IndigoRock2001
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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by IndigoRock2001 » 19 Jul 2018 23:42

circularvibes wrote:Anyone who thinks SACD is dead hasn't been to https://www.duttonvocalion.co.uk/. They release classic quad albums at a couple every couple months along with classical. SACD was never a popular format, but it isn't dead. It does tend to be more classical and jazz, but there are places to look for pop titles. Audio Fidelity released many titles before their demise earlier this year. Check out stores like Deep Discount, Import CDs and Exclusive Disc for more. Otherwise, there is still https://www.hraudio.net/ for reviews with links to sale sites, and http://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/index.php for revies, news and discussion on Hi-Res formats and multichannel sound.
This is GREAT!! Thanks so much for all the URL's I can't wait to check them out!
indi

circularvibes
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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by circularvibes » 20 Jul 2018 01:52

You are very welcome.

JoeE SP9
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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by JoeE SP9 » 20 Jul 2018 20:17

circularvibes wrote:Actually, there are Dolby matrix encoded CD's and they do conform to RBCD standards. They are playable in 2 channel, or using a Dolby decoder, it will be 5.1. There are also quad matrix encoded CD's as well, but you likely need a knowledgeable list to tell you which ones they are. The only thing not utilised in the RBCD standard was the 4 channel discrete format. This is because quad as a popular format was regrettably dead by 1980. There were also DTS encoded cd's in the RBCD standard, but you require a DTS decoder to hear them. You get loud white noise otherwise. They are not 2 channel compatible, but conform only because the sound is still in the 2 channels waiting for decoding. Most older DVD players and multichannel receivers had DTS built in.

With any matrix encoded CD they already confirm to the Red Book standard as they are matrix based audio and have no impact on the two channel signal on regular CD's. Unless you use a matrix based decoder (QS, SQ, Dolby Pro Logic) to listen to them you'd never know there was any "surround" material there.


Any sound other than the two front channels is derived and is not a discrete signal.


DTS audio and Dolby Digital are discrete systems and do not use any matrixing whatsoever.

Waves-n-Fields
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Re: SACD Dead format....Multichannel audio

Post by Waves-n-Fields » 21 Jul 2018 06:32

Acoustic Sounds is still releasing SACDs and they sound great!

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