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RB300 or RB250

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RB300 or RB250

Postby aTALLasian » 05 Mar 2013 19:59

I know this has been asked many times before, but I'm just wondering what the general opinion is about the 250 vs 300 these days. Everything I've read says that the 250 might be the way to go if upgrades like end stub and weight are planned, but I've also heard that the 300 is ultimately better once modded. For what it's worth, I've noticed that most builders (Audiomods, Audio Origami, Origin Live etc) start with the 250.

I saw this break down somewhere:

a stock 300 is better than a stock 250
a modded 250 is better than a stock 300
a modded 300 is better than a stock 250

I don't know how far I plan on going with things, but I'd probably change the weight at the very least.

There's also the option of going with the RB600 or one of the newer 3 point arms like what Etiner did, but I'm not sure I want to start drilling into my plinth... yet. :mrgreen:

Any other suggestions are also welcome.

Setup so far: Planar 3 w/ R200, Ortofon OM20, GT reference subplatter, 24v motor upgrade, dual belt, TTPSU.

-Mike
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby cats squirrel » 05 Mar 2013 21:03

I would say the preferences are about right.

Do not underestimate the hike in perceived quality of a modded 250, with new stub and counterweight. The difference is the proverbial 'night and day' (personal experience).

Also, a re-wire is said to do wonders for both. The stock stuff is nothing special.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby tomytoons » 05 Mar 2013 21:06

If you can swing the cost of a new 303 go for it.
Or the 300 if in good shape, maybe used? Check E Bay still new one on there too.
With the motor and the Sub-platter upgrade not a whole lot to ad modestly cost that is.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby aTALLasian » 05 Mar 2013 21:32

cats squirrel wrote:I would say the preferences are about right.

Do not underestimate the hike in perceived quality of a modded 250, with new stub and counterweight. The difference is the proverbial 'night and day' (personal experience).

Also, a re-wire is said to do wonders for both. The stock stuff is nothing special.


That's what I've heard and the reason why I ask. Once I get the arm and add a end stub and weight, I'll be around the cost of the 300. If left there it makes sense to go with the 250. But if rewiring is in the works, would the 300 then shine? There are some Mitchel 250s on ebay that are rewired and have the 300's stainless base. Are these upgrades worth the extra cost over a stock Rega?

tomytoons wrote:If you can swing the cost of a new 303 go for it.
Or the 300 if in good shape, maybe used? Check E Bay still new one on there too.
With the motor and the Sub-platter upgrade not a whole lot to ad modestly cost that is.


If I were to go with one of the newer arms, I would look for a used RB700 instead of a new 303. But I'm going to hold off on drilling the plinth for the moment. This table was purchased new by my dad so I'd rather leave it alone for now. (Even though the plinth will be the only stock part once I'm done)

Is there any point to sticking with a Rega branded arm? It might be my OCD, but I would keep everything Rega if I could even if the only difference is a sticker.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby aTALLasian » 05 Mar 2013 21:39

I also forgot to mention that I like the fact that the 300 has a stainless bias adjuster. I'm sure this does nothing but look nice, but being an engineer I like the quality it personifies. That's the same reason I like the R200. Being all metal gives it an air of quality.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby Alec124c41 » 05 Mar 2013 22:17

A Sumiko Premier MMT arm fits on there, sounds wonderful, has interchangeable headshells.
BTW, a Denon DL-110 on what you have will sound very good. A Dynavector DV-10x5 will be even better. Either would transfer happily to a new arm.

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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby JaS » 05 Mar 2013 23:30

aTALLasian wrote:I also forgot to mention that I like the fact that the 300 has a stainless bias adjuster. I'm sure this does nothing but look nice, but being an engineer I like the quality it personifies. That's the same reason I like the R200. Being all metal gives it an air of quality.

FWIW early RB250s had stainless bias adjusters and silver finish counterweights, although the plastic stub did nothing for looks or sound quality. The RB300 is better finished all round though.

Early RB250 in standard trim
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby JohnMichael » 06 Mar 2013 02:56

When I was first shopping for my Rega the debate was raging about what is more dependable gravity or a spring. Springs can stretch and resonate in the RB300 but the gravity of the RB250 is more dependable. The RB250 does not have to be disasembled as much as the RB300 for the rewire. My RB250 is rewired with the Incognito rewire and has the Michell Technoweight counterweight. When you use the Technoweight with the RB250 you remove the plastic end stub and install the Michell metal end stub. In the instructions for the Technoweight it suggests setting the arm so the spring is not involved with setting VTF. The Technoweight would set the tracking force. I would go with the RB250.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby aTALLasian » 06 Mar 2013 03:49

JohnMichael wrote:When I was first shopping for my Rega the debate was raging about what is more dependable gravity or a spring. Springs can stretch and resonate in the RB300 but the gravity of the RB250 is more dependable. The RB250 does not have to be disasembled as much as the RB300 for the rewire. My RB250 is rewired with the Incognito rewire and has the Michell Technoweight counterweight. In the instructions for the Technoweight it suggests setting the arm so the spring is not involved with setting VTF. The Technoweight would set the tracking force. I would go with the RB250.


VTF adjustment on the 300 is precisely what has me second guessing. The spring becomes moot if I replaced the weight correct? If the spring is removed like I've read about, the 300 seems awkward because of its mismatched bearings.

Then again, the 300 is supposed to have a higher quality tube...

I think I'm over analyzing things - OCD I tell you - but I'm genuinely interested in this. I need to be confident in my choice or it'll ruin the sound even if it isn't ruining the sound...

You getting any snow yet JohnMichael? I'm in Columbus and it's mostly icy rain right now but not looking forward to driving to work tomorrow morning.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby JohnMichael » 06 Mar 2013 04:02

Still clear here. Hoping nothing will happen until I am at work tomorrow. I am fine with snow but hate ice. If you are in Columbus maybe we can set a time for you to hear the RB250 in my system.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby nabil » 06 Mar 2013 04:47

Not sure if you're interested, but I have a used RB700 for sale. Better than either the RB300 and RB250.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby JohnMichael » 06 Mar 2013 05:19

nabil wrote:Not sure if you're interested, but I have a used RB700 for sale. Better than either the RB300 and RB250.



Of course it still has that spring.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby JaS » 06 Mar 2013 09:01

JohnMichael wrote:
nabil wrote:Not sure if you're interested, but I have a used RB700 for sale. Better than either the RB300 and RB250.

Of course it still has that spring.

I've tried playing with the spring on a couple of RB300s, but I couldn't hear a difference between the spring fully wound, unwound, or on the last occasion completely removed. I suppose I may have missed some minor element of the performance that was changed, but it definitely doesn't change the fundamental character or performance of the arm, and makes adjusting VTA a breeze :)

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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby aTALLasian » 06 Mar 2013 18:35

nabil wrote:Not sure if you're interested, but I have a used RB700 for sale. Better than either the RB300 and RB250.


Don't think that I haven't thought about it. :wink:

I think the thing keeping me from buying yours is not wanting to drill my plinth. I know Etiner did it to great success, but I don't think I'm ready for that commitment... yet.

I've also heard that a modded 250 can perform up to the same level as the 700. Albeit it would end up costing me more than your 700 in the end.
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Re: RB300 or RB250

Postby JohnMichael » 06 Mar 2013 18:54

On another site we have discussed the expense of mods. Since I bought my Planar 2 over 14 years ago I have slowly modded it through the years. Would I buy a used Planar 2 today and buy all the mods at one time? No I would not I would buy an RP6 or another brand of table. In my case the expense has never seemed great since it was spread out over many years. Good luck with your decision.
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