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Michael Lim Upgrades

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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby bacobits » 16 Jan 2012 18:23

Don't forget Michael is an engineer too. He also sells his own silicone belts.
If I ordered the double pulley I would get Michael's belts too. I already had my 2 white belts here.
I think everyone is a bit paranoid about all this and I realize this is for discussion purposes.
If my piano recordings sound good here, it is good enough for me. The double pulley seems to make the music just flow more and naturally.

I won't question it but that's me. I'm in set and forget mode.
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby watercourse » 16 Jan 2012 19:30

Good points Den. So, before I post my additional measurements, I want to reiterate that positive benefits of the double pulley were audible, in my system. Based on my previous PlatterSpeed posts, measurements using the double pulley seem to support an increased speed precision obtained by the mod - or at least by using two belts with the mod. As you will see in a future post, this observation appears to be borne out in additional measurements.

And, being a scientist (not an engineer), I want to make clear that my postings are simply a few data points. There need to be more measurements in order to come to any agreement about how to interpret the data. In other words, my measurements are not enough to draw conclusions with - if that is your goal. Like I have said in other posts, I've known all along that my TT ran fast, but it doesn't bother me. If however, I can bring it closer to the desired speed, I will experiment and post my findings for others to contemplate and build on, in keeping with the scientific method.

However, if your goal is to set and forget as much as possible, leave well enough alone and trust your ears. My rig sounds muy bueno regardless of any measured deficiencies or deviations from a standard.

More later, and take my future post with all the above in mind.
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: Beyond measurements and theory, there's intuition and feeling:
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby watercourse » 16 Jan 2012 23:16

OK all, interesting info here.

Stock black belt diameter = 1.88mm
Rega White belt = 1.77mm

Stock P5 pulley inside diameter (ID) at 33 1/3 RPM groove = 9.65mm
Michael Lim ID = 9.95mm (both grooves)

I present these to you with two caveats: my micrometer is probably not the most accurate, however, it does give an idea of relative differences. Also I ran into a problem where the caliper blades might have been too thick to get the actual ID on the Lim pulley. Someone with better tools than I do might want to jump in here and post some additional measurements.

So: my white belts are actually thinner in diameter, contrary to what was posted elsewhere.

And, given all these variables, my P5 always ran fast. Discuss!
WT Amadeus, Shelter 501 II, DV20xl, Benz ACE SL > Aleph Ono, Bel Canto PL1/Mac Mini/DAC3 > Pass INT-30A > DeVore Nines
: Beyond measurements and theory, there's intuition and feeling:
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby bacobits » 17 Jan 2012 17:27

Maybe and more than likely mine does run fast.
I have never measured or noticed it.
Thanks Wilson, now look what you have done, I have to go take something for that. :roll:
It would be nice if the TTPS was variable.
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby watercourse » 17 Jan 2012 17:58

Ha ha Den, no need for alarm. If it sounds good, it is good.
I don't plan to do anything more to get the speed more on target, unless something drops in my lap that doesn't cost anything.
WT Amadeus, Shelter 501 II, DV20xl, Benz ACE SL > Aleph Ono, Bel Canto PL1/Mac Mini/DAC3 > Pass INT-30A > DeVore Nines
: Beyond measurements and theory, there's intuition and feeling:
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby Lelolee » 20 Jan 2012 03:28

watercourse wrote:Ha ha Den, no need for alarm. If it sounds good, it is good.
I don't plan to do anything more to get the speed more on target, unless something drops in my lap that doesn't cost anything.


I was able to get the speed just right, with the Michael Lim belt, but lost the boggy. I'm back with the white belt on my P5. I love this Table :D
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby denti alligator » 20 Jan 2012 13:52

Lelolee wrote: lost the boggy


?
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby Laudanum » 20 Jan 2012 14:14

Probably meant ... Boogy.
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby watercourse » 21 Jan 2012 06:17

Or boogie... not to be confused with booger
WT Amadeus, Shelter 501 II, DV20xl, Benz ACE SL > Aleph Ono, Bel Canto PL1/Mac Mini/DAC3 > Pass INT-30A > DeVore Nines
: Beyond measurements and theory, there's intuition and feeling:
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby Laudanum » 21 Jan 2012 13:47

Yes, boogie ... duh on my part #-o
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby bacobits » 21 Jan 2012 16:16

If you boogie does that mean your a booger(er)? Past tense? #-o :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
We bad!
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby atomlow » 21 Jan 2012 19:06

We gotta let that boy, gotta let that boy

He's gotta boogie
He's gotta boogie
A-boogie b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b... boogie
So he did
An' he kept on boogin'
An' on an' on boogin'
Ahh have mercy

Well mama she told me, papa did too
Way that ya move, it's no good for you, ya gotta
A-boogie mama
A-boogie mama
Boogie mama
Boogie all night long

Baby told me late last night
Way that ya move it's just a little too tight, ya gotta
Shake it baby
Shake it baby
Shake it baby
Shake it one time for Elvis, alright

Rock it! Rock it


:D =D>
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby Lelolee » 23 Jan 2012 21:00

:lol:
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades

Postby dcginc » 05 Feb 2012 08:38

I did both the double pulley and isolation base. The base was the biggest improvement. As if I have a whole new, tuneful , record collection
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Re: Michael Lim Upgrades - RP6 Dual Pulley

Postby Drumhax » 29 Dec 2012 19:46

I've had my RP6 for a little while now and I really love it, one thing that I had noticed over time was a little wow, most noticeable in long sustained notes. Not experience-ruining by any means, but I had read about the dual pulley upgrade and thought that might be a good way to shape it up. Contacted Michael, who said he had not seen this done on an RP6 yet. He said that the 60hz (N. American version) shorter pulley should work, so I ordered that + 2 of his silicon belts, and an acrylic mat just for fun, and off I went.
Stock Pulley.JPG
Stock pulley and belt
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Received the parts from Michael about 1.5 wks after ordering (I'm in California). Michael provided good instructions for performing the surgery, which I more or less followed. I ordered a pulley puller from him, which worked well - just put down some strips of tissue to protect the plinth, twist away on the pulley puller, and hope that cracking sound you hear is the pulley glue and not the plinth. :twisted:

Once the stock pulley is off, putting the dual on is a breeze - slide onto the spindle, find a good height, and tighten up the set screw. This is where I hit a minor snag in that the 60hz pulley was unfortunately not the right size. I had a moment of concern when I quickly compared the stock and 60hz, but chalked it up to difference in styling and pressed on. Upon trying to play a record and hearing it in slow motion... nope. The 60hz pulley is too small for my RP6.
Stock vs 60hz.JPG
Stock next to 60hz NA dual pulley
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Michael was very responsive and helpful, asking me to confirm the diameter of the stock pulley (3/4") and then sending a replacement 50hz pulley right away. Received it this morning (took about twice as long to get here due to the holidays) and the first glance tells me everything is going to be alright.
Much better.JPG
60hz on the left, 50hz on the right
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Set screw vs glue makes adjusting the pulley, or in this case replacing it, a breeze. Popped on the larger pulley - looking good (this shot may actually be the 50hz pulley, I took lots of pictures and now they're all mixed up - but you get the idea).
Fitted and Strapped.JPG
Ready to rock
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First Impressions:
When I received the first shipment from Michael, I put one of his silicon belts onto the stock pulley to see how it sounded over the stock Rega belt. Immediately noticed an improvement, I would assume similar to what people have experienced with the white belts - everything focused up a bit, tighter bass.

I also tried replacing the stock felt mat with the acrylic one before fiddling with the pulley - dramatic change, bass much tighter and everything more airy. It kind of shifted the mix, if that makes sense - a more balanced presentation with more low and mid than the felt mat was putting forth.

Now that I've got the dual pulley added as well, I am overall very happy with everything I ordered from Michael. Starting and stopping is now faster (duh). Noise floor seems to be lower than it was in the previous configuration, not sure how much the pulley + belts can really impact this but I am hearing it - maybe I am just subconsciously choosing my most noise-free records (or they're the ones I like best because they sound good :lol: ). The wow issue seems to be addressed as well, and this very well could have been taken care of in the first belt swap - timing seems rock solid. And on that note, I am pleased to report that the quickness that is a huge part of what makes this table so fun is still present and accounted for.

A+ would buy again.
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Gratuitous see-through shot
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