Denon DL-103R on a Yamaha C2 preamp

[lfmudge]

I see in an old post from 2009 Arend was asking about cartridge suggestions for a Yamaha C2 preamp. I have the same unit...I found the post a little confusing from pfcs49 .. Anyway I would like to get a Denon DL-103R cartridge..Is output is 0.25mv impedance 14ohms...In the specs for the C2 it says 50uv at 10 ohms for the MC input.. Will that cartridge work with the C2 at reasonable volume.. Has anybody tried one...A yes or no as to it working will be great..Thanks Larry...

[Marcie]

Can't help you with the Yamaha but I have similar preamps from that time period, as well as a standard 103. I tried the DL-103 at 10 ohm load impedance and its output was very low. The 103R, however, has a lower impedance that the standard 103. The standard 103 should be loaded at 100 ohm, while the 103R should be loaded at 40 ohm, much closer to the 10 ohm of your Yamaha. I think you'll have lower output than is ideal but I would guess it would just be enough. Only way to know is to try out. If it doesn't work out, you can always add a step-up transformer (affordable ones from Sowther, relatively cheap or Rothwell (nicer build) come to mind; they will also help you get the right one) or hunt down a second-hand SUT. Good luck.

[lfmudge]

Thanks for the info Marcie but the DL-103R says it has a 14 ohm impedance unlike the DL-103 that has a 40 ohm impedance..But the output is only 0.25mv and the DL-103 is 0.3mv..So you can see why am confused as to if it will work or not....Any other info from people out there would be of a great help...Thanks...

[Marcie]

Thanks for the info Marcie but the DL-103R says it has a 14 ohm impedance unlike the DL-103 that has a 40 ohm impedance..But the output is only 0.25mv and the DL-103 is 0.3mv..So you can see why am confused as to if it will work or not....Any other info from people out there would be of a great help...Thanks...

I did say mine is different. Don't worry too much about the output, Denon is always conservative with output spec. It will work, only the gain of the pre-amp will be lower. The load impedance is different from the cartridge impedance. Your 103R ideally needs 40 ohms load impedance or, rather, a load higher than its own impedance. In practical terms, the 103R impedance is just slightly higher than the input impedance (load) of your Yamaha. My guess (educated though) is that it will work. Certainty can only come from empirical evidence (cf. Higgs particle), i.e. you need to try it out.

[blakep]

I see in an old post from 2009 Arend was asking about cartridge suggestions for a Yamaha C2 preamp. I have the same unit...I found the post a little confusing from pfcs49 .. Anyway I would like to get a Denon DL-103R cartridge..Is output is 0.25mv impedance 14ohms...In the specs for the C2 it says 50uv at 10 ohms for the MC input.. Will that cartridge work with the C2 at reasonable volume.. Has anybody tried one...A yes or no as to it working will be great..Thanks Larry...

Sorry no experience with the C2 (lots with 103R's though) but specs for the C2 here:

http://www.classic-audio.com/yamaha-c2-p-409.html

indicate a sensitivity of .1 mV on the MC input. This is around 68 db of gain which is plenty for a 103R. Possibly too much (60-62 is probably ideal) but you are much better IMO to have too much gain than too little and I would bet that the MC input on the Yamaha would be difficult to overload.

You should not have any problems with volume and you'll be in a much better position than most of those asking if a 103R can be used with a MC stage with 55 db of gain.

Fixed loading of 50 ohms on the Yamaha would appear to be pretty well suited to the 103R as well.

On paper, looks to be not a bad match at all.

[lfmudge]

That is good news all round ..I sure would like to give that cartridge a try..Only I see many people recommending it with a SME 3012 Series 2 and Garrard 301..If it works, should be a good combo..

[lfmudge]

Looking at the page link, I see it is for the C2a my amp is the C2 is the specs the same only the specs i found on this site says 50uv and 10 ohm load impedance,but as you say I could be looking at the wrong thing..I know the c2a is an updated model of the C2

[Brick]

I run a standard 103 through the MC port on my C-4, sounds great. I used to run my DL-301 through the same port and it was brilliant, but it has it's own step up now.

[lfmudge]

I received the Denon DL-103R in the mail today..Set it up quickly on my Technics 1700 Mark ll ...As the 301 is not ready yet... Well the DL-103R worked on the YAMAHA C2 even before I moved it over to the MC input.. It was just a bit muffled..Anyway it works real nice on the C2 MC input..A big improvement over my other cartridges...The only thing, I find it a bit bright and now it sounds the best from the C2 into my little Tube amp rather than my HTR -6130 YAMAHA Amp..But I have NEVER hard my old records sound like this before..On a recording of a live piano concert , I could hear the traffic outside the hall !!! I should have a 100 ohms not a as I think I am 14 or 50 ohms load as on the C2..So maybe I should change my amp , and it may even sound better.. I went to Vancouver a few days ago and heard a $200,000.00 system in a store...The advert in the paper said bring your record and hear... But I am sorry to say I was not impressed...But a store is not the best place to hear a system like that... Anyway if I had that kind of money I would buy a second house first....

[blakep]

Glad it's worked out for you. I would not advise making too many changes at this stage-my experience with a couple of 103R's is that they are just a bit steely and thin out of the box. They still sound very nice, but at around 15 hours the bass comes in pretty significantly and the cartridge becomes much smoother.

From there it will improve subtly to around the 50 hour mark but the change around 15 hours is pretty significant IMO. As such, I wouldn't make any drastic changes until you hit that time period-you should hear it and know it when it happens. It's only going to get better from here.

[lfmudge]

Thanks that is good news..