Denon 103R

[steve195527]

One person's 'far better' is anothers subtle difference. Tracking force is no measure of a cartridges quality as it's a function of the suspension compliance so saying the 304 is better as it needs less force than the 304 is just misleading or misunderstood.

So record damage isn't an issue?:-mistracking causes that and the lower a cartridge will track properly also reduces "normal" record wear:-don't know about you but the most expensive part of my "hi-fi" is my record collection

[steve195527]

It just follows naturally from whatever was contemporary when the vinyl was mastered. What else could that programme material have been monitored on ? And of course mastering engineers care about what it sounds like, and implicitly, what it is to be listened on. And contemporary assumptions applied, they didn't have a time machine !

This is a debate akin to the authentic-versus-modern instruments arguments in classical music. There's a validity, for sure, in maintaining contemporary playback methods for particular eras, in a preservationist sense but there's equal validity in using technological developments since the original to improve the retrieval and reproduction. I think mastering engineers understand this - I've read Stan Ricker explaining how improvements in tape playback head technology through the 1980s meant that modern half-speed re-cuts can certainly sound better than even the tapes did back in the the day and he didn't seem to think this was a bad thing.

Ian Anderson of Jethro Tull thinks(well maybe thought,not sure of his views now)that digital reproduction,of any kind,was far superior to any analogue system,so does that mean digitally remastered albums are better than original?One mans opinion doesn't mean something is correct

[steve195527]

... I don't think you can say any material is mastered to suit a certain stylus profiles,most engineers don't consider the equipment the final record will be played on....

It just follows naturally from whatever was contemporary when the vinyl was mastered. What else could that programme material have been monitored on ? And of course mastering engineers care about what it sounds like, and implicitly, what it is to be listened on. And contemporary assumptions applied, they didn't have a time machine !

following on from that we should all listen on the speakers etc used in the studio?Don't think JBL made enough to go round!

[Ldg]

Well, at least you're acknowledging that such things can make a difference, steve195527. This is what Zappa chose to inscribe on the sleevenotes for Drowning Witch :

"This album has been engineered to sound correct on JBL 4311 speakers or an equivalent...(..).... F.Z."

With vinyl, practical production and mastering decisions applied. Variously, through the era, and in some cases specifically tailored to contemporary playback styli. In any event, a certain authenticity or quite subtle 'rightness' can be the result, to my ear. And let's not forget these include top quality recordings, arguably numbering the best there have ever been. It's a matter of what was anticipated to be used for playback at the time of mastering.

[steve195527]

Well, at least you're acknowledging that such things can make a difference, steve195527. This is what Zappa chose to inscribe on the sleevenotes for Drowning Witch :

"This album has been engineered to sound correct on JBL 4311 speakers or an equivalent...(..).... F.Z."

With vinyl, practical production and mastering decisions applied. Variously, through the era, and in some cases specifically tailored to contemporary playback styli. In any event, a certain authenticity or quite subtle 'rightness' can be the result, to my ear. And let's not forget these include top quality recordings, arguably numbering the best there have ever been. It's a matter of what was anticipated to be used for playback at the time of mastering.

Lol got the album:-that's what I was getting at,the problem is hi-fi isn't really hi-fi is it?most folk put together a system to get the sound "they like":-if it was put together to be a true"hi-Fi" they should all sound the same in the same environment,ie reproducing things accurately,I doubt very few listeners go down that route
Zappa was actually giving to little info:-he should have specified arm/cartridge combo,the accuracy of the riaa equalisation expected,how far from side/back walls speakers should be positioned etc etc etc:-far too many variables to just specify speaker type

[Ldg]

To be frank (!) I would choose to play Drowning Witch on my OM40. Horses for courses. Think I just might. "4sure 4sure, like totally....."

[steve195527]

To be frank (!) I would choose to play Drowning Witch on my OM40. Horses for courses. Think I just might. "4sure 4sure, like totally....."

bet it was mastered with stanton 681 in mind,mind you their minds were probably slightly foggy