AR ES1 Bearing Grinding

[crang11]

Well I finally got to upgrade my AR XA and received a new to me cherry ES-1 today! I cleaned out the bearing well and replaced the oil with SAE 30 as per the manufacturer. Giving the inner platter a test spin with the belt still off, there was a faint grinding sound coming from the well/shaft. I put the belt on and let it run a little and same thing. I cleaned it out again and didnt see anything wrong. Replaced the oil and still a grinding. What should I be looking for? This table was in storage for 17 years before today.....

[ddarch]

the ES-1 should have a ball bearing in the well, is it there?

[crang11]

Yes- ball is in there. Cleaned the spindle where the ball goes, the ball itself, and the well. I made sure all 3 were well oiled. Really not sure what is causing that noise but I can hear it quite easily.

[ddarch]

perhaps someone switched the ball bearing but the size is incorrect? does someone else here one they can put their micrometer on? i will have to really dig to find an es-1 ball bearing, but I can if no one else has one.

dave

[crang11]

I'll get a micrometer on mine in a bit- its out in my shed and my yard is a flooded lake at the moment. The bearing does appear to fit the spindle perfectly. At first I didn't realize it was a ball, but thought it was a nub like on my XA. I was very lucky to find it in the lawn when I sprayed the spindle with brake cleaner to get the old oil off. With just a drop of oil its sticks right back into the end of the spindle.....

[crang11]

Another couple of questions too. I have the whole table broken down so I can get it cleaned up with a few coats of tung oil and repaint the top metal:

Are the motor screws 4-48 x 1/4"? I stripped the head on one taking it out. It looks like a #4 size but the thread is finer than the standard 4-40. I guess it could be metric as well.....


What color spraypaint is the best or closest match to original metal plinth? Its a bit beat up so may as well paint it while everything is broken down.

[ddarch]

I don't recall the screw size... But I remember having a very difficult time finding a replacement several years ago... I gave up and drilled a hole for a screw and bolt.

I think any satin black paint will mimic the original.

Dave

[crang11]

Thanks.....the bearing is exactly .25". I have the t-bar out and in hand spinning it. I cant tell if the grinding is coming from the bottom of the well or not. Looking at the bottom of the well it almost looks like spider legs coming out from where the ball bearing rides. I tried taking a picture:

[panman]

being an ES-1,is it a sapphire or metal bearing? bad sapphire bearings can cause grinding sounds

[ddarch]

"The major difference between the AR the Turntable and the ES-1 revolves around the main bearing. Acoustic Research upgraded plastic parts to metal. The main thrust bearing consists of an upper and lower portion. Whereas the previous bearing was a special ultra-hard Delrin plastic disc on top and a stainless steel sphere below, the ES-1 bearing boasts a sapphire disc and solid tungsten carbide sphere."

[crang11]

It really sounds like a few grains of sand in there, but I know from cleaning it out at least 5x there arent! What would the recommended fix be for a bad bearing? I do plan on getting your/the polymer t-bar and better shaft, but I cant afford it for some months. Plus I need to be able to get a new tonearm at the same time, so longer yet. Was hoping to get the better platter and lead mat first. Is there a stopgap? It cant be good to run this grinding away. I fit some Dynamat into the 'wedges' in the inner platter and around the t-bar but its loud enough to hear with a casual spin. Yikes!

Thinking through this- if the terpolymer subchassis could be machined to accept a standard armboard, I could get it a lot quicker since I wouldnt need a tonearm at the same time. Is that even possible? It would offer more versatility down the road to boot, and I could just let it grind away for a few months.

The plinth has its second coat of tung oil finish drying, 2 coats of satin black on the top metal and the dust cover got polished out today so at least it looks good.....

[ddarch]

did you apply the dynamat before or after this grinding started? it could be you through off the balance...

[panman]

If you see my avatar, it is a ES-1,i bought it many years ago locally,it was in cherry and had the sapphire bearing,weird thing is... I had the exact same problem.Sounded like sand or grit in the well.Its been a long time since I sold that table,and although Ive had a few different models of AR, that was the only ES1 Ive owned,and the only time i had that problem , Im pretty sure I went down to the local hardware store and replaced the ball and I believe that fixed the problem, or at least made it less audible,I also replaced the noisey motor,then i sold the table.The original ball in my well seemed damaged.I also thought the jewel part of the bearing may have sustained damage at one time by being chipped,never was absolutely sure ,but i knew the well was clean and shaft polished.
Try a new ball,and at least if that does not work you can always go with the shaft/bearing upgrade,and cross your fingers that solves the problem.

[crang11]

Again- I thank you all for your knowledge and help. This is my first higher end table after the XA and excitement definitely turned to frustration with this grinding. I put the dynamat on after the grinding to see if it would help. It doesnt. I made a template the shape of the wedges so all 6 are identical so it should balance. spinning the platter on a table without the ball bearing in, it balanced fine with nothing supporting the shaft. I dont really know hoe else to check the balance.

I will try another bearing and see if that helps, and post the results. I had originally bought a SOTW motor, power supply, and pulley for a table I had bought with a bad motor, but never got to install it. I will install that today or tomorrow when the 3rd coat of oil dries and I reassemble it all.