Best Tonearm for TD-124?

[OldAudio]

I finally finished the restoration of my TD-124 and sold the RMG-212 tonearm that was originally with this TT. I have two cartridges, a Shure V15 Type III and Type IV, and am looking for the best, reasonably priced tonearm to use with this turntable and cartridge combo. After some research, I have pretty much settled on the SME 3009 S2 standard or improved and the Rega RB-250 with improved extension and weight.

I would really appreciate any information, experience, opinions and/or advice anyone may have regarding the best choice, so that I can make an informed decision.

Thank You

[Alec124c41]

I've been playing with an SME 3009 II improved, detachable headshell. I'm really impressed with the sound it delivers, with a variety of cartridges. I did add a bronze bearing, rather than the plastic, and have been using a variety of headshells. I'm far more impressed with this than with the stock RB-300.

Cheers,
Alec

[Bigears]

I'd second Alec's opinion. There was a direct comparison in HiFi News a while back between the sme M2 and TechnoArm (a reworked RB250). The M2 is simply an updated 3009.

The conclusions were that whilst the Rega (and this applies to virtually all Rega arms as a dint of design) is better able to resolve bass and HF detail, this was at a price. Rega rely on the tapered tube design to minimise any resonance issues across much of the audible range but do suffer with a lift at HF. The Technoarm tried (and arguably only partially succeeded) in combating this by employing "waveform slots" and additional damping to disperse or absorb unwanted resonance and do sound better than the stock RB250. The Rega design became the benchmark of all budget arms not for its outright musical performance, because it isn't any better than Zeta's or Alphason's of old (in fact they were and still are better) but because they perfected the one piece tapered tube casting.

The sme uses a parallel armtube of lighter effective mass and carries internal damping. Older designs such as the 3009 IMHO had a better idea in the knife edge bearing than the newer set up. The musical tone carries a stronger emphasis on mid range than Rega arms at the (slight) expense of LF and HF response, but it is marginal with the M2, but arguably less marginal with the 3009.

However, if your musical tastes call for the benchmark mid range tonal accuracy, the SME, well set up, would be your best bet and it does work better with the V15. Its no coincidence because sme reputedly designed the 3009 with the V15 and similar high compliance carts in mind. The sme also has the advantage that spares are plentiful and it can be tweaked quite successfully. Its a doddle to set up and a pleasure on the eye and carries sme's benchmark excellence of engineering.

The s2 improved may be a better bet with the V15 in mind as its slightly lower on effective mass, but don't discount the excellent Mk111 with clever variable mass design and low mass tonearm which was the sompanies flagship for high compliance carts. Its a sort of a cross between the S2 and the more modern 309 in looks and whilst very expensive new fetches little more than a goos S2 these days.

[TNTTNT]

Bigears is right about SME designing the Series III around the V15. I don't have the manual with me right now, but I am sure if you look in it, there is picture after picture of SIII arms with V15 on them for demo.

I have the Series III and V15 on a Thorens 160 Super and it sounds great. It is hard to put it into words, but it is crystal clear and spacious.

My only worry about buying another Series III is the range of cartridges that suit it are becoming a dying breed. I only know Ortofon with a compliance rating of around 20.

The benefit of the Series 3009 is it has a higher mass of 12.5g vs 4.5g of the Series III, so you may have a wider choice of modern cartridges if you change your V15 out for something new.

[Bigears]

The benefit of the Series 3009 is it has a higher mass of 12.5g vs 4.5g of the Series III,

ahh, it depends which variant. The S2 improved is 6.5g which is why the S2R was manufactured as this enabled medium to low compliance carts to be used. However, the effective mass of the S2 or Mk3 can be increased by adding headshell weight to cope with lower comliance carts.

I wouldn't personally worry too much over cart availabilty as there are plentiful supplies of 2nd hand V15's etc and new replacement stylii. I have bought a NOS new in box Sonus cart with a compliance of 50! that would sing on the Mk3...

[bastlnut]

I finally finished the restoration of my TD-124 and sold the RMG-212 tonearm that was originally with this TT. I have two cartridges, a Shure V15 Type III and Type IV, and am looking for the best, reasonably priced tonearm to use with this turntable and cartridge combo.......

hallo,

the answer is;
the one that sounds best to you.

there are more arms than the SME and Rega....they are just budget arms....
many are considerably better too.
i say that one should not limit himself, and get some actual experience with what the tonearms that sould come in question sound like.

regards,
bastlnut

[Bigears]

I think the question was this:

and am looking for the best, reasonably priced tonearm

and the response:

there are more arms than the SME and Rega....they are just budget arms....

With respect...so what? They are by definition reasonably priced tonearms which perform well. Not everyone can or will stretch to obscenely priced tonearms. The turntable deserves a reasonable arm and the sme is an eminently sensible choice.

The fact is that to better either on today's new market, you will have to spend £1000 plus. A new 309 is now £1170. Thats more (no disrespect meant here OldAudio) more than the TT is worth.

Sorry, but this is a bugbear of mine whenever someone chips in and poo-poos kit because it isn't expensive enough. To a sensitive soul that could be construed as rather insulting

[bastlnut]

hallo,

how about an Audio Technica AT-1100 tonearm?
price is right and the sound is not as wooly as the 3009,
and better organized than the Rega.
that is only to mention 1!
there are of course others.....like the Sumiko's, or Zeta, Syrinx, Manticore, Nottingham A, Helius.....
i am not poo pooing anything.
if the budget can be stretched some, there are other choices as well.

regards,
bastlnut

Edit.....
ps. i didn't even say anything about the cartridge that is going to be used....

[funkhawk]

Actually, you should try a Grace g-704.
Marvellous sound and I think it will visually match with the td-124.

[soulmerchant]

well, if I was on a budget I would look at these items on the 'bay:

200409330381 - grace G-940
200408128384 - fidelity research fr54
250522823997 - grace G-545F (maybe contact him and offer what you think you can afford - it never hurts to ask...)
260512276574 - audio technica at-1005

If you are looking for cheaper then we can go there... but then you will have to get a cheaper turntable...

[RED_One]

I wonder where & how would that Arnold Sugden SAU2 Bigears has would compare to the SME with the Shure V15?

[Bigears]

I wonder where & how would that Arnold Sugden SAU2 Bigears has would compare to the SME with the Shure V15?

Dont know of an Arnold Sugden! I still have the Arthur Sugden SAU2 and to be honest its roughly on a par with the 3009, but the 3009 wins out...just.

Of the other tonearms mentioned above, I'd second the Grace 545 and At1005, bith cacking good arms.

Don't discount the new Jelco's either as they are exceptional VFM and reasonable performers. I would throw in the Clearaudio Satisfy too, but recent price hikes have seen this little gem shockingly over priced now and simply not worth the money.

[RED_One]

My apologies to Arthur

Can I ask of what nature character is the shortfall ?

Is the SAU2 more limited than the SME in cartridge types?

[analogous]

The simple fact is that the RMG-212 is the best 9" tonearm for the TD-124. You will need an Ortofon SPU. The SPU is expensive. But I cannot understand why you would get a TD-124 and then use something like the Shure V-15 or a Rega arm.

That's like buying a Ferrari and getting rid of the V10 or whatever and replace it with a straight 4 motor from Fiat.