New looking for a project need some advice

[duficity]

Idler drive uses a rubber wheel between the motor spindle and platter. The motor turns the wheel and the wheel turns the platter. They can create more noise, due to the mechanicals involved, but have excellent torque for start up and drive. The motors tend to be very robust. Idlers are having a resurgence lately when mounted in very substantial plinths, which tend to reduce their noise. Older Garrard 301 and 401, Thorens TD124, Lenco L75 and similar tables are selling for much more than their original price. Rek o Kuts havent gotten that pricey yet, but are just as good. I am refurbishing a B12H now.

[whtwter]

Thanks for the clarification on how the idler drive works!

I decided to go with the a Rek-O-Kut n-33h belt drive TT that came with a s-120 tonearm. I have a friend who has a Grace g714 and a Infinity Black Widow Tonearm that he wants to trade me for some motorcycle parts. Looks like I have the foundation just need to make some decisions on which tonearm and the plinth design.

[cats squirrel]

"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less."

"The question is," said Alice, "whether you can make words mean so many different things."

[whtwter]

Hmm...I have read that book and think I get what you mean. If I get the Cheshire cat to blow some magic smoke on it it will sound great whatever it is made out of. Am I right I have read through your website a few more times as well as some others...took me a couple times to grasp all of the information provided. Looks like I will have to build a few quick n dirty plinths and play around till I find something I like then make it look good! Now to read up on tone arms and figure out what I have.

[duficity]

If you do not chose to use the Grace 714, I'll take it off your hands, or maybe trade for something else I have around.

[whtwter]

main portion still needs finish and dorrs but is coming along nicely!

IMG_0851.JPG (83.45 KiB) Viewed 1212 times

end shelf with the first coat of finish

IMG_0849.JPG (109.87 KiB) Viewed 1212 times

Update and a few questions. Moving right along with the media cabinet and enjoying the TT but I am getting a hum. I have tried putting a ground wire to the tone arm and no change. Same with the motor. Tried both a earth ground and grounding to the pre amp. The hum gets louder when the tt is turned off. there is a ground wire going from the motor to bar that the tone arm is wired to...could this be the culprit? I am thinking I could eliminate that wire ad a three prong plug to the motor for a earth ground and ground the tone arm to the pre amp. Any thoughts? Something I found odd and probably irrelevant but interesting...when I had the ground to the motor with the tt on and tone arm at rest I bumped a rca from the tv and got muffled audio through the speakers. Another thing I notice is on a few albums I get no base but when i toggle from left to right I will get base in one channel or the other is this normal?

Duficity... if I get rid of that arm you will know first!

A few pics

[Alec124c41]

Are the phono plugs a tight fit? If not, pinch the skirts until they are.

Cheers,
Alec

[whtwter]

Thanks Alec,
I'm not sure if you are referring to the RCA's or cartridge leads so I checked both. RCA's are tight cartridge wires are questionable. The clips on the headshell were huge and even when crimped wiggle a bit that is why the tape is on to keep them from shorting. I did a comparison to a John Lennon 320kps file to the same song on a new record and the MP3 sounded way better. What should I look at to correct this and should I expect better out of the TT? I have new jumpers ordered current cartridge is a ortofon om 5e,Rek-O-Kut s 120 tone arm and I am using the phono input on a HK Citation 17. MP3 is running through the same pre amp. Better cartridge, Phono pre amp upgrade all wiring in the tone arm? BTW the cartridge is set at the proper distance, aligned and the weight is set at 1.75 g.

Thanks, Cheers

[duficity]

put a toothpick in the cartridge leads and pinch them to make them tighter. They should not wobble on the cartridge pins. If you pinch too tight, then just jam the toothpick back in to open up a little. The toothpick keeps you from just squashing the leads flat.

[whtwter]

Thanks for the suggestion. That was the first thing we tried but they are just to big for that to work.

[dtut]

Whtwter,

Great looking cabinetry.

I just "restored" a Rek-O-Kut 120 arm. "Restored" is in quotes because I had to do serious surgery on the wiring. After I got the pivot bearings cleaned and the old DJ smoke scum off the metal, I decided to check continuity before firing it up on the L-34 table. I only had continuity through one wire and I had shorts to the arm and between wires. And to really sweeten things up, one of the head shell/cartridge connectors broke off where it had been soldered.

I wasn't prepared to try any re-soldering in that cramped space with the likelyhood of melting plastic in the process, so I pulled out all the original wiring - arm and head shell - and associated little bitty parts and ran new wiring through through the resulting holes all the way to the cartridge. I used digital D connectors for the cartridge connectors.

I can't completely detach the head shell, now, so I pull it part way out until the pin is past the collar then rotate it part way around until I can get at the cartridge, do whatever I need to do then rotate it back and cinch it.

The rewiring was actually pretty simple once I decided I had to do it, but I did have to pull the arm from the vertical support. The bearing points back out easily and the arm is so simple it's easy to work on and those bearings needed cleaning anyway. I twisted both sets of new wires, one CW and the other CCW, but didn't twist them together. I ran a wire from the vertical support to the motor and from there to the pre and don't have any hum.

I like this arm, I like its appearance and like the way it sounds. I hope you have good luck getting yours working.

Doug Tuthill

[whtwter]

I put the new head shell leads in and that is right now however it did not fix the hum. After testing I was sure it was the arm wiring but decided to check everything one more time before tearing into it. It's kind of a rats nest around the bar all the wires attach to and with a bit better lighting I noticed a tiny copper wire attached to the ground wire going to the motor. it wasn't attached to anything but was hitting 3 of the posts on the RCA side of the bar. Clipped and removed it and no hum!

So now that I have all the issues sorted I am going to start the new plinth but have 2 questions.

1 Can the ground strap from the motor to the tone arm be removed and replaced with a 3 prong earth ground? I plan on separating the motor from the main plinth.

2 How do I ground the tone arm? It looks like the ground strap from the motor is currently attached to the negative RCA leads...If I remove that would I replace it with a ground wire to the pre amp?

Ok 1 more...what are the benefits or downfalls to a removable arm board? I thought it might be nice to have a set up where tone arms could be changed without major surgery!

Cheers

[PeterW.]

I know this is a very broad question but I am hoping I can get some responses to help me narrow my options. my goal is to have a great looking and sounding turntable without breaking the bank...I am very skilled in woodworking Is 3-400 doable? I know this is a broad question but the more I read the more options come available and the more I need direction!
**Some Snippage**

Thanks, Chris

Doable? Certainly.

I happen to have a leftover Rabco center bearing, platter, syncro motor and so forth, already on an aluminum plinth (which you would trash, of course). Point being that you would have your platter and belt-drive system (33/45) already to hand. You would have to reset the system and suspend it properly within your plinth, but you were going to do that anyway. Leaving the bulk of your budget to be spent on the arm.

The cost of shipping gets you all of the above and saves it from landfill. Not a bad start-up. If you are in the US, figure less than $20 anywhere by parcel post. Overseas - perhap not so much of a bargain unless I dismount the critical parts and send you only the motor/bearing/platter/speed-change mechanism.

Contact me directly p f j w at a o l dot c o m

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

If you want to look up the manual in the library, look for the Rabco ST-6 from HK.

[bpbutler]

1 Can the ground strap from the motor to the tone arm be removed and replaced with a 3 prong earth ground? I plan on separating the motor from the main plinth.

Each metallic point on your TT should be grounded by exactly one path. So, you can do exactly as you describe: ground the motor to the 3rd prong, and ground the tonearm to the amp. The ground strap should not be installed in this case since that would create a ground loop.

2 How do I ground the tone arm? It looks like the ground strap from the motor is currently attached to the negative RCA leads...If I remove that would I replace it with a ground wire to the pre amp?

My preference is to run a separate wire for ground independent of the signal reference. The outer shield on the RCA connector is not, strictly speaking, ground. It is the signal reference. It happens to be 0 volts on most systems, but in certain cases (such as a differential system) it is not.