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VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

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VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby drjjpdc » 10 May 2012 05:06

Hi, I just found Justin's very good info on setting VTF.

viewtopic.php?f=34&t=31039&hilit=tracking+force

The only other thing I want to ask is a friend of mine tried to adjust it the other day with some troubles. He had a VTF gauge and set the tonearm on it and the VTF values kept changing while it was just sitting there. Was a screw loose somewhere? Also the arm won't drop down to the platter if I just take it off the rest and move it over the platter. Sometimes the arm went down with some very light finger pressure. Also I am having trouble finding the recommended VTF for an Empire 888 PE (did not see it in our database). BTW, the arm was re-wired last year and bearings cleaned and lubed. Does the lubrication need to be done every year? I know there are probably some simple answers, help!
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Re: VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby gkimeng » 10 May 2012 17:29

Check to see if there is a small pin in the oblong hole on the side of the arm housing. If the pin is still there, the factory arm-drop damping is still engaged, and after this many years it is almost certain to be seized. Pull the pin out to disengage the damping. It isn't supposed to be doing anything while a record is playing.
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Re: VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby drjjpdc » 10 May 2012 19:09

Did that already. Was I supposed to lubricate anywhere special after pulling the pin? I read somewhere in an old manual the damping is affected by how close the tonearm is to the platter like about an inch or so? I just don't get why the arm won't drop down by itself.
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Re: VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby gkimeng » 10 May 2012 22:07

The damping is two cylinders with grease between them. The pin connects the arm to damping on descent and the oblong hole disengages it once it's on the record. Pulling the pin means the arm is permanently disengaged from damping. If it's still binding, the screw pins on the side of the arm may be binding, either because the screws are tightened too much or their seats are damaged.
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Re: VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby pogo » 11 May 2012 00:25

Dumb question, but is there enough slack in the tonearm wires to allow the tonearm to lower? WRT VTF gauge readings changing -- "VTF gauge" can be a lot of different things. Balances, spring gauges, and strain gauges. I have a digital gram scale that's pretty sensitive. On a suspended system like this it would definitely be jumping around if there is any disturbance at all.
Nothing is ever as bad or as good as it first seems.
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Re: VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby drjjpdc » 11 May 2012 05:49

Ok an update. There is enough slack. Pogo, that's what happened to my friend. He has an expensive digital scale and the values were jumping all around too. Going up and down by a third to half a gram without touching anything! The next question is what's wrong and why are the values dancing around?
I did a few things on my own and noticed that the sleeve above the spindle that you screw into is really hard to get equal on both sides. Even after I thought I got it and tightening the pivot screw just a bit, when you lifted up the arm it still looked liked it could move a bit side to side. To get the arm down down I find I have to lift it up at a 35 degree angle and then drop it on the LP after lifting it off the rest. Damn for a simple arm this thing is complicated.
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Re: VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby pogo » 16 May 2012 21:38

Hi. Hope by now your problem is solved and this will be superlous. If not, then I'm sorry this help has been slow motion. I don't get around here as much lately.

First, do read and heed gkimeng's post. You didn't respond whether the damping has been disabled or not -- or whether you know.

Second, Here is a sketch of the XA tonearm. Just to be sure we're talking about the same things, I'll use the terminology from the sketch. (Though I do need to be allowed one excursion into a pet peeve. "dampening" refers to making something wet. "damping" is a completely different thing, and is what we're really talking about here.)

21962

Is the damping pin present or no? If it is then a gunked up damping system is very likely your problem (see gkimeng). Second thing is that I believe that there was originally a fiber/paper washer between the pivot and the block that it screws into. This is almost certainly long gone, so when you say you tightened the "pivot screw", if you mean the "pivot/spindle" in the picture then it's quite possible that you've created some drag in the damping mechanism.
This isn't a problem if the pin is removed. If the pin is removed, then see gkimeng. You need to tear the thing down and see what's going on. Carefully unscrew the two pivot screws and examine them for burrs and damage at the points. Pull the block out and examine the delrin inserts for damage. I'm not too good at describing what you should see, but just realize that if everything were perfect the only real contact between the pivot screws and the seats would be at the very point of the screw. If you're not sure what you see, post a picture if you can. Good luck, and if you've already solved you problem, then you're probably busy listening to music, so I won't expect a reply.
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Re: VTF adjustment on an AR XA tonearm

Postby drjjpdc » 22 May 2012 04:47

Pogo & Gkimeng,

First thank you for all your help. I did remove the damping pin. Funny thing is I was close with my friend's VTF gauge. But it still sounded a bit off, piano strident and kind of brittle (horns too). I increased the vtf on my own by ear (yes that old fashioned device) and the piano and horns on my LP changed significantly. It needs some more cleaning and adding some cone type feet and when I do that I'll post some more pics.

John
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