To Upgrade, Or Just Buy More Vinyl?

by **mmarston** » 02 May 2012 06:12

My theory when I was young was to use the best table & cartridge I could afford, with whatever junky amp & speakers were on hand, while building my record collection. That way the records stayed in good shape until I could acquire better electronics & speakers. A cool side effect was that my tapes for the car sounded way better than those of my equally impoverished friends.

Now, years later, I have a hall closet full of records that mostly sound great!

Oh, I also quit lending them to friends when I was 15... That helped a lot.

Best,
Mike

by **totomatic** » 02 May 2012 07:19

You can still buy brand new speakers and still have spare money for vinyl http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-20005175-47.html

$35 at amazon.com

Get more respectable sound from your records than the one you're currently using. will not compare to a decent vintage turntable, but hey, this will get you going in no time, plus it has a built in preamp
http://www.amazon.com/Technica-AT-LP60-Automatic-Driven-Turntable/dp/B002GYTPAE

$106 in total!

by **Hepokatti** » 03 May 2012 00:29

totomatic wrote:Get more respectable sound from your records than the one you're currently using. will not compare to a decent vintage turntable, but hey, this will get you going in no time, plus it has a built in preamp
http://www.amazon.com/Technica-AT-LP60-Automatic-Driven-Turntable/dp/B002GYTPAE

No offense to anyone, but DO NOT buy this turntable. It is similar plastic junk you have right now. Probably has a poor ceramic cartridge and tracks badly. You can't adjust VTF nor anti-skating (nor I think they're pre-adjusted very precisely)..and you can't swap cartridge anyway, not to mention the other flaws in design.

With similar (or lower) price, if you have a little bit of patience, you may find a good condition Technics T4P table like SL-Q300. These are much better tables than some modern era junk, and with a good stylus they can actually do wonders.

As a budget vinylist myself, I strongly recommend researching what things are important in vinyl playback before making any purchases, and you will soon be able to evaluate yourself what tables might be acceptable.

by **KeyboardKat** » 03 May 2012 09:23

Wow, thanks for all of the information!

I definitely care more about the quality and reliability of the turntable itself than that of the speakers and amp, so I'm fine if I skimp on the later to upgrade the former.

Also thanks for all of the link, I'm most likely going to grab one of those turntables and a similar amp, and those $25 speaker sounds fantastic for the price. Another question...

What's the deal with pre-amps? What are they for, what do they do, how do I know if an amp has one or not?

Also, would it be worth getting a lesser turntable and spending more to replace the needle and cartridge, or just going with a better turntable with good/average needle and cartridge?

by **Rob998** » 03 May 2012 10:43

KeyboardKat wrote:
What's the deal with pre-amps? What are they for, what do they do, how do I know if an amp has one or not?

Also, would it be worth getting a lesser turntable and spending more to replace the needle and cartridge, or just going with a better turntable with good/average needle and cartridge?

A pre amp is used to boost the signal from the turntable to a level that can be used in a line level input (e.g "CD" "AUX" "TUNER" or "TAPE" etc) on an amp/receiver that doesn't have a "PHONO" input (which is basically a built in pre-amp). If your chosen amp does have a Phono input you won't need a pre-amp, unless you buy a table with a moving coil cartridge, which isn't likely given your budget, but you never know what might turn up at a yard sale!

A label marked "PHONO" on the amps selector switch is a good indicator that it has a phono stage built in, like on the knob on the far left in the picture below, but make sure you ask before you buy!

I'd buy the best table you can afford and stick an affordable cartridge on it as you can always upgrade the cartridge at a later date. Buying a lesser turntable & putting an expensive cart on it is more likely to show up the shortcomings in the table rather than transform it into a giant killer.

by **dlaloum** » 03 May 2012 13:09

Debatable as to the priorities....

But what is not debatable is you should start with a TT that is at least a vintage mass market midrange table - ie: it may not be top of the line, but it is well built and engineered - and has no major design flaws. So it keeps speed reliably, has an arm with proper adjustments for alignment and tracking force, with good quality bearings, is either Linear tracking, or has a good means of controlling and adjusting anti-skating/bias force, and has either a p-mount or 1/2" cartridge mounting. (the only proprietary cartridge mounting outside of these two that I would recommend would be the Bang & Olufsen one)

Once you have the table, you have to assume that you will need to replace the stylus or the cartridge - and either way it should be chosen to match the arm on the turntable and the phono stage.

This matching up of the components is critical and will count a long way towards achieving the best results with the least outlay.

A vintage integrated amp or receiver with an onboard phono stage/input is usually the most economical way to amplify the signal from the TT.
For the one purchase you get a Pre-Amp, Phono Stage and Power Amp built into a single box.... at the budget level of spending, that means you pay 1/3rd the price for the same performance level!

And then there are the speakers.... Always worthwhile being picky about the speakers. - I had a really really cheap basic pair of speaker for years - but I made up for it with a really nice set of headphones (usually 1/10th the price of equivalent performance speakers!) - until I could afford the speakers I really wanted.

HTH

bye for now

David

by **Bran Kulez** » 03 May 2012 13:50

I second David's headphone recommendation. For under $100.00 you can get a good pair of headphones that will sound better than most cheap speakers. I have a pair of Grado SR60 's that were about $80.00.

by **fscl** » 03 May 2012 14:14

kkat,

Welcome to VE....

Can be done on the cheap. This is the season for garage / tag / estate / spring cleaning sales. You can find some really great stuff for not so much money. On top of that, you can also run into nice used vinyl......

Another alternative here:

http://groups.freecycle.org/FreecycleYorkPA/description

Join, sign up and post. Latest turntable was found this way. Actually sounds OK with a cartridge I had lying around and definitely will not damage vinyls....... Don't know what you have spinin' right now but the key is to have a turntable that will not damage the vinyls you have.... otherwise you may have to rebuy them in the future....... #-o

Nothing damages vinyl faster than tracking too lightly and or having a bad stylus.......

I've tried some Proof of Budget systems built around a Tivoli radio, phono stage, a sniped Technics "non working" made to work tangential and powered computer speakers. Nice headphones or even ear buds you like can suffice for some intimate critical listening.......

You may have some of this in your possession already.....

Good luck

Fred and we all started with a budget system some where / time in our lives.......

An original iPod new was $300..... :shock: