SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

compact disc, dacs, mp3 players and streaming audio
terry-a
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by terry-a » 15 Aug 2018 21:04

IndigoRock2001 wrote:Yes. I've found out here and in another thread that my Pure Direct dream is just that. Now I have to figure out how to choose between listening to the players DAC and using the tape deck or another input I use for playing my digital, as there is only one AUX input and no tape loop. There are a long row of RCA inputs with a video input for each LR pair, clearly for an analogue analogue to all of the HDMI inputs. I've got to do a bit of experimenting to see if I can use those for essentially another AUX audio input. It's a bit spooky as the amp needs to have it's inputs assigned, coupled with it's autodetection of HDMI inputs. It might be that I could assign the RCA outputs from the SACD player into one of the RCA inputs unused by a 'mirror' HDMI input. For example into the Satalite TV input which has nothing going into it on the HDMI side.
indi
Remind me which amp you have.

terry-a
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by terry-a » 15 Aug 2018 23:56

terry-a wrote:
IndigoRock2001 wrote:Yes. I've found out here and in another thread that my Pure Direct dream is just that. Now I have to figure out how to choose between listening to the players DAC and using the tape deck or another input I use for playing my digital, as there is only one AUX input and no tape loop. There are a long row of RCA inputs with a video input for each LR pair, clearly for an analogue analogue to all of the HDMI inputs. I've got to do a bit of experimenting to see if I can use those for essentially another AUX audio input. It's a bit spooky as the amp needs to have it's inputs assigned, coupled with it's autodetection of HDMI inputs. It might be that I could assign the RCA outputs from the SACD player into one of the RCA inputs unused by a 'mirror' HDMI input. For example into the Satalite TV input which has nothing going into it on the HDMI side.
indi
Remind me which amp you have.
This is off topic relative to the original post, but if you're using the Sony BDP-BX37 player and the Denon AVR-2809CI, simply connect the left and right line out jacks on the Sony to the left and right CD inputs (next to the phono inputs) on the Denon.

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 16 Aug 2018 09:06

terry-a wrote:This is off topic relative to the original post...
No problem. My question was answered and, who knows?, I may learn something of interest in the off topic discussion.

IndigoRock2001
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by IndigoRock2001 » 18 Aug 2018 03:12

Sterling1 wrote:Hybrid discs may have a CD layer, stereo SACD layer, and a multi-channel SACD layer. Now, my experience with two players, a circa 1999 Sony DVP-S9000ES, which plays DVDs, CDs, and stereo SACDs, and a new OPPO UDP-205, which plays virtually any disc, although purchased to specifically play multi-channel SACDs: In most cases, no matter which player I am using, I cannot distinguish the stereo SACD layer from the CD layer; however, I can easily distinguish the multi-channel layer from all other layers and multi-channel seems to me to be more life-like than stereo SACD/CD. With the older Sony player, some three layer hybrid discs to not play in stereo SACD. At any rate, for anyone that has a 5.1 home theatre with HDMI input, a new Sony Universal Player will accommodate CDs, DVDs, BDs, Ultra BDs, SACDs, and multi-channel SACDs through HDMI connection. One of the new Sony players is an Elevated Standard product, which I think would satisfy anyone. One more thing, I believe that multi-channel SACD can deliver a more enjoyable music listening experience than anything else out there today which I've heard. So, if the music I want is available on a hybrid disc with multi-channel SACD layer, I'll buy it. If no multi-channel layer exists, I'll just buy the CD.
I just got a pretty new Sony that seems to play everything. Not having any Ultra BD's I don't know about them. I have a 7.1 home theater system and I wanted the SACD capability primarily to play multichannel disks. There are so few of them though, and as my musical taste is pretty rarified anyway there isn't much I want to hear. I'm listening to music I never thought I'd listen to again, Moody Blues :oops: Stones 8) Cream :roll: To my surprise I'm really enjoying it. The Cream and Stones are SACD stereo only, but I think they sound pretty good, I don't have regular CD's of this music to compare to, but I, like you, don't think I would do more than buy the CD in future if I wanted to listen to this music. It seems like multichannel now is being put onto BlueRay which makes sense as it requires no special player or amp. They are just as expensive as multichannel SACD's though. Seems like that has to change if they're going to become common mediums of expression for a lot of artists. My player has no option to choose layers, so I can't compare CD layer from stereo SACD layer. Since I'm interested now in hearing hi-rez music in general I'm focussing most on finding the best DAC to play normal CD's. I was quite hot to get a NAD player, but I think really the new Sony sounds so good, I'm not going to spend the money. I have a new found interest in CD's though as now they sound pretty good on my new Denon amp and Sony player.
indi

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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by IndigoRock2001 » 18 Aug 2018 03:25

terry-a wrote:
IndigoRock2001 wrote:Yes. I've found out here and in another thread that my Pure Direct dream is just that. Now I have to figure out how to choose between listening to the players DAC and using the tape deck or another input I use for playing my digital, as there is only one AUX input and no tape loop. There are a long row of RCA inputs with a video input for each LR pair, clearly for an analogue analogue to all of the HDMI inputs. I've got to do a bit of experimenting to see if I can use those for essentially another AUX audio input. It's a bit spooky as the amp needs to have it's inputs assigned, coupled with it's autodetection of HDMI inputs. It might be that I could assign the RCA outputs from the SACD player into one of the RCA inputs unused by a 'mirror' HDMI input. For example into the Satalite TV input which has nothing going into it on the HDMI side.
indi
Remind me which amp you have.
Denon 2809CI. I had the chance to buy one from the 3***CI series but didn't see it before I bought this one. It's interface is kind of primitive. But as it originally cost around 700 Pounds I reckon it was fairly high end when new. It sounds I must say really good. No multichannel RCA inputs though so I can't listen to multichannel using the players DAC. Honestly it sounds good enough that I haven't even experimented with trying out the players DAC compared to the amps.
indi

VinyldechezPierre
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by VinyldechezPierre » 18 Aug 2018 17:41

In the process of listening/comparing my SACD and CD by Norah Jones. This test is being conducted with two CD players; my DVD/SACD player has developed a new problem and is not available...

Right now, I have to say I am not convinced.

The CD is in the lesser (quality) player, a Pioneer PD-F1007 (300 CD jukebox kinda player) and the SACD is in a Marantz CD-60. But honestly there is not a whole lot of difference in sound quality between the two. This Pioneer way exceeded my expectations when I got it.

Now, there is a sound quality difference. The SACD is clearer. But not enough in my opinion to warrant the price difference even though I got this SACD for about the same price as a new CD. The thing is, I haven't bought a new CD in years. Well, ok, not quite true; I do buy some CDs new when I can't find them used but that is very rare.

So either the 16€ for the new SACD or an average of 1 to 3€ for a used CD, my choice is made.

Still one test to make when my DVD/SACD player is fixed.

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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by Sterling1 » 18 Aug 2018 19:31

VinyldechezPierre wrote:In the process of listening/comparing my SACD and CD by Norah Jones. This test is being conducted with two CD players; my DVD/SACD player has developed a new problem and is not available...

Right now, I have to say I am not convinced.

The CD is in the lesser (quality) player, a Pioneer PD-F1007 (300 CD jukebox kinda player) and the SACD is in a Marantz CD-60. But honestly there is not a whole lot of difference in sound quality between the two. This Pioneer way exceeded my expectations when I got it.

Now, there is a sound quality difference. The SACD is clearer. But not enough in my opinion to warrant the price difference even though I got this SACD for about the same price as a new CD. The thing is, I haven't bought a new CD in years. Well, ok, not quite true; I do buy some CDs new when I can't find them used but that is very rare.

So either the 16€ for the new SACD or an average of 1 to 3€ for a used CD, my choice is made.

Still one test to make when my DVD/SACD player is fixed.
It's multi-channel SACD which brings out SACD's life-like sound. Today, it's real easy to hear it, since 5.1 home theatre systems with HDMI input accomodate the latest Sony Ultra BD Players, which have multi-channel SACD playback capability via their HDMI output. Amazon has hundreds of Hybrid SACD's with a multi-channel layer in most genres.

Sterling1
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by Sterling1 » 19 Nov 2018 18:26

Here's good news: I just went to Amazon's CD and Vinyl page where I discovered 2017 and2018 multi-channel SACD releases. This, I think, is because many of today's BD Players play multi-channel SACD via HDMI and thus the AVR which the BD Player is connected to can play multi-channel SACDs with no SACD equipment expense. Since the multi-channel SACDs deliver music with more breadth and depth than stereo SACD or CD, it is not a surprise that folks would want to begin buying them.

terry-a
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by terry-a » 19 Nov 2018 20:26

Sterling1 wrote:
19 Nov 2018 18:26
Here's good news: I just went to Amazon's CD and Vinyl page where I discovered 2017 and2018 multi-channel SACD releases. This, I think, is because many of today's BD Players play multi-channel SACD via HDMI and thus the AVR which the BD Player is connected to can play multi-channel SACDs with no SACD equipment expense. Since the multi-channel SACDs deliver music with more breadth and depth than stereo SACD or CD, it is not a surprise that folks would want to begin buying them.
Could you mention some of the multi-channel SACDs you found there?

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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by Sterling1 » 19 Nov 2018 21:06

terry-a wrote:
19 Nov 2018 20:26
Sterling1 wrote:
19 Nov 2018 18:26
Here's good news: I just went to Amazon's CD and Vinyl page where I discovered 2017 and2018 multi-channel SACD releases. This, I think, is because many of today's BD Players play multi-channel SACD via HDMI and thus the AVR which the BD Player is connected to can play multi-channel SACDs with no SACD equipment expense. Since the multi-channel SACDs deliver music with more breadth and depth than stereo SACD or CD, it is not a surprise that folks would want to begin buying them.
Could you mention some of the multi-channel SACDs you found there?
Yeah, I could but there are 32 2017 and 2018 multi-channel SACDs on just the first 3 pages of multi-channel SACDs, so, just Google Amazon and then search: SACD multi-channel. I just purchased a 2018 multi-channel release of Elgar short symphony works. Still waiting for its arrival.

terry-a
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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by terry-a » 19 Nov 2018 21:33

Sterling1 wrote:
19 Nov 2018 21:06
terry-a wrote:
19 Nov 2018 20:26
Sterling1 wrote:
19 Nov 2018 18:26
Here's good news: I just went to Amazon's CD and Vinyl page where I discovered 2017 and2018 multi-channel SACD releases. This, I think, is because many of today's BD Players play multi-channel SACD via HDMI and thus the AVR which the BD Player is connected to can play multi-channel SACDs with no SACD equipment expense. Since the multi-channel SACDs deliver music with more breadth and depth than stereo SACD or CD, it is not a surprise that folks would want to begin buying them.
Could you mention some of the multi-channel SACDs you found there?
Yeah, I could but there are 32 2017 and 2018 multi-channel SACDs on just the first 3 pages of multi-channel SACDs, so, just Google Amazon and then search: SACD multi-channel. I just purchased a 2018 multi-channel release of Elgar short symphony works. Still waiting for its arrival.
I wasn't having much success there so I thought I'd ask.

As far as I can tell there's about a dozen titles from Amazon via prime and all the rest are 3rd party vendors.

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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by Soundboy » 08 May 2019 22:51

Sterling1 wrote:
13 Aug 2018 11:37
Hybrid discs may have a CD layer, stereo SACD layer, and a multi-channel SACD layer.
There are only 2 layers to a hybrid SACD....

https://www.audioholics.com/audio-techn ... s-cd/image

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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by Soundboy » 08 May 2019 23:03

Sterling1 wrote:
15 Aug 2018 11:57
I purchased the Norah Jones Hybrid SACD. It has three layers: CD, Stereo SACD, and Multi-Channel SACD. I prefer the multi-channel layer, it just sounds more realistic. I play from OPPO UDP-205 to Sony TA-P9000es analog multi-channel preamp to Sony TA-N9000es and TA-80es power amps.
There are two versions of Norah Jones' "Come Away With Me" SACD. The initial Blue Note Records SACD version famously featured a two channel "high res" mix using the CD layer mix. Later on, Analogue Productions remastered the two channel "high res" mix, combining it with the "high res" multi-channel mix, and reissued it on SACD again.

Here's the link to the Analogue Productions SACD version.....

https://store.acousticsounds.com/d/8182 ... annel_SACD

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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by 1Tobb » 12 Aug 2019 05:09

I have been spending a ton of money on SACDs but from what I can gather the only ones that are 5.1 are the Hybrids.
Unless they specifically state 5.1.

I have a 7.2.1 that will soon be ATMOS which is the latest.
I am now in the process of selling my subs because although the room is 16 x 24 my powered mains have way more base then I need without subs.
The real joy is 5.1 which you don’t need ATMOS for.
There are other formats like DTS with DVD Audio however they must state 5.1 for multi channel
Once you go Multi Channel nothing else will suffice.
Same thing with Blurays too many of which are only two channel!
That and their recordings tend to be hit and miss.
Out of 500 music Blurays I have only about 100 are as good as the 5.1 recordings!
If you don’t have 5.1 you are wasting your money with a Super Audio Hybrid.

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Re: SACD vs. SACD Hybrid

Post by Sterling1 » 14 Aug 2019 10:30

1Tobb wrote:
12 Aug 2019 05:09
I have been spending a ton of money on SACDs but from what I can gather the only ones that are 5.1 are the Hybrids.
Unless they specifically state 5.1.

I have a 7.2.1 that will soon be ATMOS which is the latest.
I am now in the process of selling my subs because although the room is 16 x 24 my powered mains have way more base then I need without subs.
The real joy is 5.1 which you don’t need ATMOS for.
There are other formats like DTS with DVD Audio however they must state 5.1 for multi channel
Once you go Multi Channel nothing else will suffice.
Same thing with Blurays too many of which are only two channel!
That and their recordings tend to be hit and miss.
Out of 500 music Blurays I have only about 100 are as good as the 5.1 recordings!
If you don’t have 5.1 you are wasting your money with a Super Audio Hybrid.
I don't know of any 5.1 only SACDs out there. Seems all 5.1 SACDs will also have a SACD stereo recording and a CD layer.