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sme-ile, restoration success!

 
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Bigears
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Joined: 22 Jun 2007
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Location: uk

PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:37 pm    Post subject: sme-ile, restoration success! Reply with quote report post

Welllll, whilst waiting for my Lumley amp (due back mid week next week completely rebuilt) I embarked on restoring a Garrard 401 given to me by my father in law (what a nice chap). I checked the motor (all fine and like new) idler wheel and bearing (like new) and spindle/thrust bearing (all good) and only had to apply a little fully synthetic car engine oil to the felt washer for the spindle. The plinth was a shop supplied veneered chip-board horror and the arm an ok-ish Connoiseur SAU2 with removable headshell (now for sale, if interested PM me, its going cheap and its in good condition...).

I spent the week custom building a new heavyweight plinth, and new to Garrard decks, surmised that mass is what counts so duly made up a plinth made from 3 layers of 19mm MDF (!) and cased in exotic 4 by 1 inch Meranti hardwood, now french polished to within an inch of its life. The top board will be cut out for the arm when it arrives (anyone any tips for mounting 3009's?) and then finished with black leatherette). I'll post some photo's in Reader's Systems when finished.

The space for a replacement arm is tight but it will just accommodate a 3009. As luck would have it, I managed to find one (not on the Bay as these tend to be over-priced such is their appeal) but privately. I'm now the proud owner of a mint series 2 improved with additional ADC Magnesium headshell, sharkwire interconnect and full FD200 damping kit, all for the princely sum of £200. Result, and cheaper than a retail new RB251 (thank goodness I didn't have to go down that route which was the only option on budget).

Any tips for finishing and setting up greatly appreciated as I'm no 3009/401 expert. The mounting seems important due to the feedback encountered when playing in the original plinth so I'm fitting (bling gold plated) adjustable 1" spikes to the base and sitting the leviathan on a granite slab or similar (trouble is I need a 400 by 450mm lump and most tescos/Argos/Asda chopping boards made of granite are 300 by 400m Crying or Very sad ) Any other ideas where I can obtain a decent base at sensible money ("hifi isolation granite plinths are over £100 and no different except for being slightly bigger than the 30mm thick granite chopping blocks at £10...go figure).

I'll wait for completion of everything and hooking up the Lumley before posting pictures, and will be interested to hear how the Garrard compares with my Gyro/309 TT by comparison.

Lucky me.
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J.D.
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Joined: 14 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

Congrats, sounds like you're on your way.....

Three items come to mind:

● On the topic of Support Shelf.... Slate is very good, and on an informal survey (my collation of net posts over yrs...) the slate gets better marks than granite. Generally for reasons of being composed of geo-crushed layers and less pingy/ringy than granite. As it's used for home & garden, you can find slabs for relatively inexpensive outlay. Look for an inch thick or more.

● One tip on the setup / dial-in of the Sme arm: Lateral balance. This is a fiddle around thing, something Sme arms do not share with others, but is required to set the knife-blade in proper contact. An aspect that takes some trial & error to get really right, but makes a definite performance difference.

● Garrard plinthing... yet another fiddle-around parameter that can take awhile is nestling your garrard into the plinth comfortably. Look for .. no linkage elements touching wood of plinth .. motor free and clear on its spring-mounts .. wiring for motor loosely draped & touching minimum of internal plinth .. tonearm wiring well away from ac cabling ... In short, every sub-system well situated and able to operate optimally without interfering elsewhere.

It seems that with such a lot of participatory installation --ie with separate elements being manufactured (plinth) or having to be tweaked into harmony, rather than arriving that way from the factory---- that maybe Patience is the ultimate setup tool.
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DaveyW
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

Sounds Excellent - Looking forward to seeing the pics.
Might inspire me to have a go at recanning my TD160, something I've oft considered but need the inspiration.
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VinylIsTheBest
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Joined: 08 Apr 2008
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Location: United States

PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

J.D. wrote:

● One tip on the setup / dial-in of the Sme arm: Lateral balance. This is a fiddle around thing, something Sme arms do not share with others, but is required to set the knife-blade in proper contact. An aspect that takes some trial & error to get really right, but makes a definite performance difference.


I have a SME 3009 Improved arm.

What are you noticing different when adjusting the lateral balance wayrod, different from the manual instructions? Less bearing friction? Difference in sound?

The instructions tell you to slide the wayrod to the weight of your cartridge.

Regards.
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J.D.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

In my experience the change with a more-correct lateral balance is-- whether via the way-rod, or, on the "R" with the sliding lateral hex leadscrew-- cleaner sound, simply put.
Lower noisefloor, maybe, but cleaner.
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VinylIsTheBest
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

J.D. wrote:
In my experience the change with a more-correct lateral balance is-- whether via the way-rod, or, on the "R" with the sliding lateral hex leadscrew-- cleaner sound, simply put.
Lower noisefloor, maybe, but cleaner.


Thank You J.D. for the tip.

I will try it at different settings and see if I hit that cleaner sounding spot.

Regards.
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Alec124c41
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Joined: 28 Oct 2002
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Location: Toronto, Canada
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

For pieces of stone, check suppliers of stone countertops and floor tiles. The stone floor tiles seem to be about 18 inches square, and they can cut a couple of inches off one side for you.

Cheers,
Alec
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dominic harper
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Joined: 24 Apr 2007
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Location: Preston, England.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

Hi everyone, regarding the lateral balance, best way to adjust this is to support the arm infront of the knife edge and also behind the knife edge using two screwdrivers or similar lifting the arm slightly and observing if the arm has a tendency to twist one way or the other. If it does adjust the wayrod accordingly. Soundstage and detail will be improved. These arm get a lot of bad press but this is prob due to poor setup. If anyone is interested i can modify these arms. This includes re-wiring internally and externally, damping the arm tube, phono sockets, and improvements to the pillar bearings. All these improve the 3009. Im looking into manufacturing a headshell for the fixed headshell version to add more mass and damping. Regards Dom.
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Bigears
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Joined: 22 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

Thanks for all the tips guys. I'll play around with the arm when it comes. I believe its the metal knife-edges bearing variety on the lower of the series II improved serial numbers (with a 215.6mm mounting distance).

The plinth is now completed and rather than use the pretty useless original rubber isolarion washers, I took four sorbothane flatfeet and cut out four tuppence sized circles, put a hole through each and threaded onto the mounting stubs. What a difference that made after I slackened off the mounting bolts (being a plonker I over-tightened to begin with which sort of defeats the use of the sorbothane). Motor rumble not totally eradicated from plinth (if I stick my ear to the plinth, some slight rumble still comes through).

I have though of trying those 301/401 platter damping rings available on the Bay too, but will wait and see what it sounds like.

I'm currently sourcing some Welsh slate for the base as its way cheaper than anything equivalent and easily cut to size. Polishing will be achieved with worktop wax (a blend of Carnuba and other waxes).

All in all about 40 hours work so far but hopefully worth the effort. I must admit, it looks pretty professional now everything's re-assembled and a huge improvement on the shop supplied horror plinth bought new (why did they do this...its like supplying a decent bottle of Chablis with a paper cork!).
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VinylIsTheBest
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Joined: 08 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

dominic harper wrote:
Hi everyone, regarding the lateral balance, best way to adjust this is to support the arm infront of the knife edge and also behind the knife edge using two screwdrivers or similar lifting the arm slightly and observing if the arm has a tendency to twist one way or the other. If it does adjust the wayrod accordingly. Soundstage and detail will be improved. These arm get a lot of bad press but this is prob due to poor setup. If anyone is interested i can modify these arms. This includes re-wiring internally and externally, damping the arm tube, phono sockets, and improvements to the pillar bearings. All these improve the 3009. Im looking into manufacturing a headshell for the fixed headshell version to add more mass and damping. Regards Dom.


Dom,

Just completed your two screwdriver test. Lifted the arm and it did not twist in any direction, lifted straight up. My wayrod is set at the correct setting. It matches my cartridge body weight, so the instructions are correct for my arm (cartridge body weight matching wayrod setting).

Thanks for the information.
Regards.
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Bigears
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Joined: 22 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

Update

I managed to get a one hundredweight slab of polished 1.5 inch thick slate today for £20, about one tenth of what a hifi emporium would charge for the "ultimate isolation platform" from a monumental stone mason business just down the road. A good tip for all you seeking a similar product for peanuts...go visit a headstone manufacturer or other masonry business. Thats the base sorted for the Garrard.

Interestingly (and another tip for you Garrard owners) the proprietor of the masonry business confirmed that he could cut out a large slab using the required Garrard template and the charge was estimated to be around £300 for a beautiful heavyweight Garrard plinth.

It doesn't take a genius to work out that's £700 cheaper than ordering one from one of two uk 01/401 specialist plinth suppliers dealing in such things....
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dominic harper
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Joined: 24 Apr 2007
Posts: 229
Location: Preston, England.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote report post

Hi Bigears, as regards the platter damping rings i have two fitted to my platter and they make a world of difference. Took one off the other day just to see if it made a difference and sound became very slightly blured so i recommend using two. Regards, dom.
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